[DukeRem]

Hello all. I'm a newcomer into the world of digital projectors, so I'm sorry if my questions will sound "stupid".


I'll have to buy a projector in the next 2-4 months and I absolutely don't want to spend more than 2.500$, which is already the maximum I can afford (2.000$ would be much better, actually).


I'd like a DLP projector, since the black is much better, but I saw that now there are many new LCD, like Sanyo PLV-Z1, which have quite a good contrast ratio.


I read about the Infocus-X1 (DLP) with 2000:1 of contrast and a low price, but it seems it's not as good as its specs would show. So now I'm very confused.


Could you please help me? I have a room about 14,5 long, and I'd like to use a screen of 80" to 100".


Thanks in advance.

 

[Alain Tuypens]

I picked my Sanyo PLV-Z1 up last friday evening for 2200 euro all in. My dealer proposed to test the Z1 so i could compare it with other gear he had in demo...such as infocus 110, davis and piano (all DLP machines).

And guess what....even out the box it outperformed all the DLP machines.

The image was much sharper, no screendoor at all (3m on a 2m white 1.2 gain sreen), colours were much more intense/vibrant (washed out on DLP's), and blacks...believe me or not but blacks and contrast were better too, no dead pixels either nor the famous gray mist.

I could see on his face that he was blown away by the picture.(Moulin rouge-(elephant))

Shame on the manufacturers who still try to sell us gear at 5000+$.

At home i connected the Z1 to a non-progressive DVD player via S-video.

I have a 1.6m/0.8m light grey wooden "screen" of a bureaudesk. Again the experience was fine. No artifarcts like vertical banding, contrast even better, and no scaling artifarcts. Very fine indeed.

As i use a HTPC i immediatly tested it with the PC. My desktop was in 1024/100hz. To fill the screen i had to apply the digital zoom. And here i saw vertical banding from time to time.

So i downloaded "Powerstrip" latest version and installed the predifined 960/540 dtv-60hz-setting. After the reboot i have now a 16/9 image on my computerscreen. I launched windvd 4.0 and ...WOW.... there it was.... a very sharp image and no artifacts at all. And yes, the colours were a bit on the green side....So, i played with the individual settings "green, red, bleu" on the Z1. I simply raised the bleu and red with about 10 points.

After tweaking the gamma, brightness, contrast, sharpness i launched the fifth element SB....and the result was one that few people have experienced.

I own the latest sony 16/9 TV.....well.....i prefer the Z1-picture .......

The Z1 was in dark mode all the time. Very silent and the bulb will last 3000h. The lumen you give up is a no brainer.

There are simply no words to describe this phenomene....

Trie it yourself.....and no, i'm not a dealer, and yes i had projectors in the past.....

 

[DukeRem]

Thanks a lot for your post. I already heard very good about the Sanyo. What about the Sony VLP HS10? Did you see it, also? Should cost a bit more than the sanyo (something like 300 more or so) but should have higher resolution and DVI input, but a bit less contrast ratio.


And what about the Infocus X1 and its 2000:1 contrast ratio, for just 1500$ or so?


Thanks again.

 

[Alain Tuypens]

HS10: True, it has a higher resolution. This is a) important if you look HDTV and b) reduces screendoor. When you sit at min "2 X screenhight" there will be no visible screendoor with Z1. And HDTV is not available in Belgium... yet. But HS10 should look a bit sharper.


Hs10 has DVI, and this would be theoraticly better as a digital signal will not be converted to analog and vice versa. But, the difference in image quality will be very marginal (say 5%) as D/A conversion is really good. Also you need sources with DVI output....

With the HS10 you need to buy a special cable as their connection with a simple vga cable to a pc is not conform. This will set you back another 50-100 euro. I went for the HS10 too a month ago but the difference in price

didn't justifie the higher lumen (1200 vs 700), DVI and higher resolution.

On the other hand the z1 offered more contrast and Sanyo developed a technique to eliminate the "gray mist". These two things were more important to me + the fact that it cost 1200 euro less. Also lamps with low lumen generally cost less. Anyway, i am very pleased with my Z1.

There are reviews on this forum where people did a side-by-side comparison between the HS10 and Z1, and they look both almost the same.


As for the "DLP".... it has a higher contrast.... but......"Rainbow" seems to be more pronounced with higher contrastratio's.....


I prefer the RECENT LCD's, as they are cheaper, have very nice colours, (their strongpoint against DLP) and contrast is at a level that is almost "perfect" (read: no issue.)(1200/1)

Screendoor and death pixels are not an obstacle at

"2 X screenhight", which gives you an angle comform to THX.

My advice...? Go as cheap as possible, but get at least 800:1 CR, 700 lumen, 16x9 and 960 x 540 pixels. (got the point?)

CU

Alan

 

[andyZRH]

Unfortunately we don't know that much about the Infocus X1 yet, because only a few people could get their hands on one of those so far. But I guess this will change quickly and the first reviews have already showed up here in the forum. (e.g. http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...hreadid=195808 ).


There are three things I'm a little worried about with the X1


- Rainbows: the X1 has a slower (2x) color wheel than other HTPJs. On the Plus Piano, I only saw the Rainbows when I tried really hard, such as moving my eyes very quickly from left to right (on and off the screen). But since the X1's wheel is only half the speed I might see them while just enjoying a movie which would be a deal-killer for me.

There's only one way to find out: Find a dealer with the X1 on display and have a look at the picture. If you don't see the rainbows you're fine.


- Noise: a 37dB rating looks quite loud on the spec sheet but best thing is again to find out yourself whether you mind the noise or not. Personally I could probably live with a little more noise, considering the price.


- build quality: At a price that much lower than other DLPs on the market I'm a little worried that they might have cut back on the level of quality. On the other hand they're offering a 2-year warranty plus a free service plan for three more years (this one covers labor only), which means you're not taking much of risk quality-wise.


I'm currently heavily biased towards DLP PJs but I have to admit that I haven't seen any of the latest generation LCDs (such as the Sanyo Z1) yet. I will certainly have a look at some of them too before I finally buy a PJ.


andy (who can't wait to see the X1 in action)

 

[DukeRem]

Thanks for your comments. About six months ago, I was about to buy a projector, and ever advice was to "buy a DLP one" (especially the Plus Piano).


Now, six months have passed and the situation is quite different: new LCD pjs have born, and I hear VERY good things about them. The Sanyo PLV-Z1 is probably the best exemple: for a few more than 2.000€, you can buy it, and it has 800:1 contrast and 16:9 native display.


Unfortunately, I only saw DLPs for professional presentation, that are not suited for home theatre: they are quite too bright and I think I noticed the rainmbow effect (if I understand well, it's a multicolor effect that occours on the borders of the shapes on the screen).


Since Infocus X1 is thought both for work and home use, I think it won't be as good as Plus Piano for the rainbow effect. The good is that it costs a few (about 1500$, dunno how much will cost here in Europe), and has a long lamp life (3.000 hours). BTW: does the X1 have a 6 segment wheel? If yes, shouldn't it be 4x instead than 2x?


But I'm trying to get the best for around 2.000€, no matter if LCD or DLP, to view my movies on a 80" to 100" screen, better if 16:9. I'm trying to find a place, here in northern Italy, where I can see the Sanyo Z1 at work...any advice?

 

[Herb]

DukeRem,


I thought DLP was for me. I bought a Sharp M20X, based on the good reviews that it got here on the forum. I could not enjoy it at all. I saw rainbows everywhere. I wanted to like this PJ, but had to return it. I then thought I would have to sacrifice deep blacks and go for an LCD.


So I got a Sanyo PLV-Z1. I turned it on thinking that it would be acceptable but not engrossing. I was wrong. It is great.


I know that if I did a side by side comparison with the Sharp 90U or any of the more expensive PJs, I might feel differently. But watching the PLV-Z1 in my room with my movies, I cannot imagine having paid any more for any other PJ. How much more enjoyable would those PJs be? Twice as much? I don't think so.


Long story short (too late), audition some. Your opinion is the only one that matters. My advice is that you do not always get more when you pay more.


Herb

 

[DukeRem]

Dear Herb, thank you. What I need to do now, it to see the Sanyo in action into some local store.


Unfortunately I won't find any dealer with the Infocus X1, to compare against it. That's why I was asking if anyone saw the two objects side by side.

 

[Alain Tuypens]

If the projector will be used from time to time in an office environment to display powerpoint etc. then definitely go LCD. Text and graphics are more stable and sharper. Richer colors too.

Don't go to big with the screen in an office with poor light conditions.

700 lumen will be the minimum. Also 4:3 aspect is better suited for this purpose. Up to you where you put the weight....

Alan

 

[DukeRem]

No, I'm going to use my pj ONLY for HT. That's why I was considering DLP.


Besides, I'll be watching movies mainly through a HTPC, that's why I asked for DVI input.


Last but not least, the screen dimension should be no less than 80" (I have a big room, about 14,5 feet (4,3 meters) long.


Thanks again.

 

[andyZRH]

Quote:

Originally posted by Alain Tuypens If the projector will be used from time to time in an office environment to display powerpoint etc. then definitely go LCD. Text and graphics are more stable and sharper. Richer colors too.

Not exactly my experience. We use an IBM-labeled Infocus LP130 (DLP) at work and the picture quality easily matches or tops most LCDs I've seen so far (for presentations that is). The picture is actually very sharp and I've never noticed a lack of picture stability.


IMHO the major issues when buying a PJ for business use (besides price) are brightness, resolution and (depending on what you use it for) portability and/or noise. For all these it doesn't make much of a difference whether the PJ uses DLP or LCD.


andy

 

[DukeRem]

...but I'm not interested in a business pj all the same


I'm looking for a good HT pj, and I've yet to decide between a good LCD (Sanyo Z1) or a cheap DLP (Infocus X1).

 

[audible]

To answer your question DukeRem, the colour wheel on the X1 is 4 segment RGBW. In presentation mode the white segment is active, in movie mode it is off. So I guess the simple answer is that it is indead a 2x wheel.

 

[DukeRem]

Too bad...then, it could indeed have worse quality than some other "low spec'd" DLPs, like the Plus Piano, even if on the paper it has a very high contrast ratio (2000:1).

 

[Alain Tuypens]

 http://www.projectorcentral.com/home_theater_watch.htm

Their review will be posted this month.

But as you will only buy in a couple of months their will be other pj....

Things change every day in this business

So, stay tuned....

 

[DukeRem]

True But I thought that, being in the Christmas season, many new pjs would come out, while in the months after, the marked could slow down a little bit