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Discussion Starter #1
So I bought a Vizio P50, returned it, and now trying a brand new Samsung JU1700. Basically I have a Tivo premier and when watching TV the colors just look off and too bright. For example, if I'm watching a new cast and they show a picture with black bars on the sides, the bars looks so bright. I'm using default out of box settings. Do I need to step up to a TV with "Nano Crystals"?
 

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Discussion Starter #2
So I bought a Vizio P50, returned it, and now trying a brand new Samsung JU1700. Basically I have a Tivo premier and when watching TV the colors just look off and too bright. For example, if I'm watching a new cast and they show a picture with black bars on the sides, the bars looks so bright. I'm using default out of box settings. Do I need to step up to a TV with "Nano Crystals"?
So I found out that my Tivo is only outputting 720p according to the info option on the TV. Looking to see if I can change that to 1080P to start. Not sure why it's putting out 720 since my old Tivo seemed to work fine.
 

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So I bought a Vizio P50, returned it, and now trying a brand new Samsung JU1700. Basically I have a Tivo premier and when watching TV the colors just look off and too bright. For example, if I'm watching a new cast and they show a picture with black bars on the sides, the bars looks so bright. I'm using default out of box settings. Do I need to step up to a TV with "Nano Crystals"?
You cannot use default out of the box settings on any TV - they NEVER look good. That's why the settings are adjustable. You have to find a picture mode that works best for you, then spend time adjusting all the settings to get the picture too look good. Default usually looks like crap. Find settings that other owners here have posted in the official thread for your TV and use them as a guide and a starting point, then tweak them to suit your particular content/viewing habits/room environment etc etc. I tend to use my local news broadcasts as a quick reference to adjust things like Contrast, Brightness, and Colors. I use the faces and hair and clothing of various anchormen/women and weather girls on CBS and CW (both are 1080i channels) to dial in the correct settings. For me, facial detail is the most important thing to get looking right so i go there first. As long as i can get their faces to look natural and their clothing to look realistic and detailed, i'm not so concerned about that wood counter not looking quite accurate or that red Porsche color looking a little inaccurate.

To get your black areas to look black right now, use the Brightness setting. Lower it until black areas are a dark blob, then raise it until you can start to see detail like pinstripes or button holes on a man's black suit. Use the Contrast or Picture setting to set the overall screen brightness.



So I found out that my Tivo is only outputting 720p according to the info option on the TV. Looking to see if I can change that to 1080P to start. Not sure why it's putting out 720 since my old Tivo seemed to work fine.
The Tivo Premiere doesn't have a 1080p setting (except for Pass Through) but it does have 1080i. I have found that setting Tivos and Cable DVRs etc to output everything at 1080i Fixed gives the best detail on every TV i've ever installed or set up (more than a few dozen now). The 720p Fixed setting makes the picture noticeably softer, with some channels being a lot softer. Just set it to 1080i Fixed and be done with it.


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The manufacturers discovered a long time ago that among two TVs displayed side by side at a a retailer the brighter one sells better. So that's why they aim for maximum, unreal, brightness with their out-of-box defaults. Lots of the bad things to happen to PQ over the years have happened because of this phenomena.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
So I bought a Vizio P50, returned it, and now trying a brand new Samsung JU1700. Basically I have a Tivo premier and when watching TV the colors just look off and too bright. For example, if I'm watching a new cast and they show a picture with black bars on the sides, the bars looks so bright. I'm using default out of box settings. Do I need to step up to a TV with "Nano Crystals"?
You cannot use default out of the box settings on any TV - they NEVER look good. That's why the settings are adjustable. You have to find a picture mode that works best for you, then spend time adjusting all the settings to get the picture too look good. Default usually looks like crap. Find settings that other owners here have posted in the official thread for your TV and use them as a guide and a starting point, then tweak them to suit your particular content/viewing habits/room environment etc etc. I tend to use my local news broadcasts as a quick reference to adjust things like Contrast, Brightness, and Colors. I use the faces and hair and clothing of various anchormen/women and weather girls on CBS and CW (both are 1080i channels) to dial in the correct settings. For me, facial detail is the most important thing to get looking right so i go there first. As long as i can get their faces to look natural and their clothing to look realistic and detailed, i'm not so concerned about that wood counter not looking quite accurate or that red Porsche color looking a little inaccurate.

To get your black areas to look black right now, use the Brightness setting. Lower it until black areas are a dark blob, then raise it until you can start to see detail like pinstripes or button holes on a man's black suit. Use the Contrast or Picture setting to set the overall screen brightness.



So I found out that my Tivo is only outputting 720p according to the info option on the TV. Looking to see if I can change that to 1080P to start. Not sure why it's putting out 720 since my old Tivo seemed to work fine.
The Tivo Premiere doesn't have a 1080p setting (except for Pass Through) but it does have 1080i. I have found that setting Tivos and Cable DVRs etc to output everything at 1080i Fixed gives the best detail on every TV i've ever installed or set up (more than a few dozen now). The 720p Fixed setting makes the picture noticeably softer, with some channels being a lot softer. Just set it to 1080i Fixed and be done with it.


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Hooked up the Xbox sand it looked very good. Hooked the Tivo back up and the images looks almost SD. I'll take a pic soon.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
You cannot use default out of the box settings on any TV - they NEVER look good. That's why the settings are adjustable. You have to find a picture mode that works best for you, then spend time adjusting all the settings to get the picture too look good. Default usually looks like crap. Find settings that other owners here have posted in the official thread for your TV and use them as a guide and a starting point, then tweak them to suit your particular content/viewing habits/room environment etc etc. I tend to use my local news broadcasts as a quick reference to adjust things like Contrast, Brightness, and Colors. I use the faces and hair and clothing of various anchormen/women and weather girls on CBS and CW (both are 1080i channels) to dial in the correct settings. For me, facial detail is the most important thing to get looking right so i go there first. As long as i can get their faces to look natural and their clothing to look realistic and detailed, i'm not so concerned about that wood counter not looking quite accurate or that red Porsche color looking a little inaccurate.

To get your black areas to look black right now, use the Brightness setting. Lower it until black areas are a dark blob, then raise it until you can start to see detail like pinstripes or button holes on a man's black suit. Use the Contrast or Picture setting to set the overall screen brightness.





The Tivo Premiere doesn't have a 1080p setting (except for Pass Through) but it does have 1080i. I have found that setting Tivos and Cable DVRs etc to output everything at 1080i Fixed gives the best detail on every TV i've ever installed or set up (more than a few dozen now). The 720p Fixed setting makes the picture noticeably softer, with some channels being a lot softer. Just set it to 1080i Fixed and be done with it.


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Here is a pic of what I'm seeing when the Tivo is the source.
 

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Everyone is correct - the TV needs to be calibrated. It's difficult to tell by a photo what the problem is that you're seeing with your eyes.

Also, keep in mind that video game graphics tends to look quite good even in overly bright vivid modes (the same holds true with animated films), so you can't make accurate comparisons using video games.
 

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Here is a pic of what I'm seeing when the Tivo is the source.
Any LCD will look poor and washed out when viewed from a 45 degree angle like that, so it's hard to tell what you're seeing. LCD TVs only look good when viewed from straight on. And any pictures you post are being viewed by us on our PC monitors so even a good picture will look crappy anyway.

When you say the picture looks almost like SD, is it when watching HD channels on cable and/or antenna? Some channels look a lot better than others. Who is your cable company?

How do the local CBS and NBC and ABC HD News broadcasts look?

Have you put the TV into an appropriate picture mode and properly adjusted the settings yet? If not, there's no point in complaining about the TV or discussing anything further. You HAVE to adjust the TV in order to get it to look good. There's no way that TV should make HD look like SD so start digging into those setting menus.

Edit - i just found an Official JU7100 Owners Thread and see that you've already posted stuff there, so why did you start this new thread instead of just posting about your issues in that Official thread where this TV is already being discussed?


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Discussion Starter #11 (Edited)
Everyone is correct - the TV needs to be calibrated. It's difficult to tell by a photo what the problem is that you're seeing with your eyes.

Also, keep in mind that video game graphics tends to look quite good even in overly bright vivid modes (the same holds true with animated films), so you can't make accurate comparisons using video games.
Seems like faces are blue and over all the colors are just not rich. Any suggestions for calibration? I think I've seen a Disney bluray our there to assist..?
 

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For starters, press the info button on your TiVo and to ensure that it indicates a 1080 source. Then press the info button on your TV remote to be sure it is getting a 1080 source.
Then check your TV settings to be sure you're not in "Demo" mode as someone indicated earlier.
Go to your picture settings and select "movie" mode. Be sure the backlight is set at about 50% (mid range) of its scale. Do the same for brightness (mid scale).
I don't know what other settings are available for your set, but you should be able to find that in the thread for your TV as suggested above.

Edit:
In a quick look I don't see settings listed in the thread for your TV.

These are user DRN94's settings for my set (UN65F800) that I used as a starting place when adjusting my TV...

Picture preset: Standard
Backlight 20
Contrast 100
Brightness: 45
Sharpness: 0 (20 max)
Color: 50
Tint: G50/G50
Picture size: Screen Fit
Dynamic Contrast Off
Black Tone Low (Helps hide dark tone compression artifacts)
Flesh Tone 0
Color space Auto
Gamma 0
Color tone Warm2
Digital Clean View Off
MPEG noise filter Off
HDMI Black level Low
Film Mode Auto2 (Best for deinterlacing set top box feeds)
Motion Plus On (LED Clear: On, Anti-Blur 10, Anti-Judder 0 or 1)
Smart LED Standard (I prefer High)
Cinema Black On
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Here is a pic of what I'm seeing when the Tivo is the source.
Any LCD will look poor and washed out when viewed from a 45 degree angle like that, so it's hard to tell what you're seeing. LCD TVs only look good when viewed from straight on. And any pictures you post are being viewed by us on our PC monitors so even a good picture will look crappy anyway.

When you say the picture looks almost like SD, is it when watching HD channels on cable and/or antenna? Some channels look a lot better than others. Who is your cable company?

How do the local CBS and NBC and ABC HD News broadcasts look?

Have you put the TV into an appropriate picture mode and properly adjusted the settings yet? If not, there's no point in complaining about the TV or discussing anything further. You HAVE to adjust the TV in order to get it to look good. There's no way that TV should make HD look like SD so start digging into those setting menus.

Edit - i just found an Official JU7100 Owners Thread and see that you've already posted stuff there, so why did you start this new thread instead of just posting about your issues in that Official thread where this TV is already being discussed?


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I wasn't sure it the TV since I had the same complaint with the Vizio P50. Just odd that the 4k demos on a usb stick look great and so does the Xbox but yet TV is just poor in my opinion. I'll try to make some adjustments and also pull out an hd antenna for comparison to the Tivo. Thanks!
 

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Seems like faces are blue and over all the colors are just not rich. Any suggestions for calibration? I think I've seen a Disney bluray our there to assist..?
A true calibration requires a light meter and specialized software. You can DIY but the learning curve is steep, not to mention the additional cost of the equipment. There may be a professional calibrator in your area. Cost can be anywhere from $250 upwards.

The best you can do with a calibration disk alone is make some semi-accurate adjustments to the basic settings. You won't be calibrating your panel but that may be all you need.

Using another's settings is a popular method, but not recommended, to adjust your tv. But all your doing is adjusting your panel to another tv which doesn't take into consideration your particular panel's component tolerances or your viewing environment. No two tv's are exactly the same and will respond differently to the same settings.
 

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A true calibration requires a light meter and specialized software.... Using another's settings is a popular method, but not recommended, to adjust your tv. But all your doing is adjusting your panel to another tv which doesn't take into consideration your particular panel's component tolerances or your viewing environment. No two tv's are exactly the same and will respond differently to the same settings.
I agree completely. That's why I told the OP that I used DRN94's settings as a "starting place" when adjusting my TV. If the OP tries these settings and they don't help, he can always return to the original settings (that he doesn't like). In no way was I suggesting that his TV would become "calibrated" if he used those settings.
 

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Wow, these 4K panels seem very unfriendly to off axis viewers, on axis is a lot better, but I also noticed the picture got even better at night (darker and richer looking color). I just disabled the eco because it appears to have been dynamically changing settings. Still pretty bad at the off axis settings, but I'm not sure if there is anything 4K that will work at a 40-45 angle..?
 

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...Using another's settings is a popular method, but not recommended, to adjust your tv. But all your doing is adjusting your panel to another tv which doesn't take into consideration your particular panel's component tolerances or your viewing environment. No two tv's are exactly the same and will respond differently to the same settings.
But when a new owner is completely clueless on how to adjust his settings, using someone else's settings is a good starting point and can be somewhat of a guide on what to set and how high or low to set it, and more importantly, what picture modes to use. For instance, someone may mistakenly set their Brightness really high thinking it will make the screen brighter, then adjust the Contrast really low to make it look washed out, but then he finds someone else's settings and where the Brightness is low but the Contrast is high and realizes he had been going the wrong way.

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Wow, these 4K panels seem very unfriendly to off axis viewers, on axis is a lot better, but I also noticed the picture got even better at night (darker and richer looking color). I just disabled the eco because it appears to have been dynamically changing settings. Still pretty bad at the off axis settings....
It's not just 4K panels, the viewing angles on ALL LCD TVs is poor whether they're UHD or 1080p or 720p. It's the single biggest complaint people have about LCD TVs for the past dozen years. It's just a limitation of LCD screen technology.

I'm pretty sure the big Samsung LCD TVs use VA panels which have narrower viewing angles than TVs such as LG that use IPS panels. VA panels have better black levels but poorer viewing angles, while IPS panels have wider viewing angles but poorer black levels. I prefer the VA panels since black levels are more important than viewing angles in my man-room so i only shopped for TVs with a VA panel. A large family that watches movies together would be better off with an IPS panel. My Sony W800B (VA panel) has really lousy viewing angles but it doesn't matter to me since i view it pretty much straight on.

As for looking better at night, that pretty much goes for any TV even going back to the old Tube TV days. TVs have more pop in a darker environment.


. . . . . but I'm not sure if there is anything 4K that will work at a 40-45 angle..?
No LCD TV will be able to maintain it's contrast at 45 degrees off-axis, not even an IPS LCD TV. LCD TVs simply start to get washed out when you move off center and get worse the farther you go.

If viewing angles are very important to you, you might want to consider getting a Plasma TV if you can find one, or hold out for the new LG UHD OLED that will be released sometime this year.




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Wow, these 4K panels seem very unfriendly to off axis viewers, on axis is a lot better, but I also noticed the picture got even better at night (darker and richer looking color). I just disabled the eco because it appears to have been dynamically changing settings. Still pretty bad at the off axis settings, but I'm not sure if there is anything 4K that will work at a 40-45 angle..?
That's a function of the panel type to a large degree. LG's S-IPS panels have excellent off-axis viewing but their blacks leave something to desire. OTOH, Samsung S-PVA panels have excellent blacks but off-axis viewing is really bad. Other panel types are somewhere in-between. There's always a trade-off.
 
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