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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Anybody want to venture a guess as to why they seem to top out at $250 on the price side and quality side?


They have a decent selection of state-of-the-art TV's and HDTV's and even some decent audio/speaker equipment. I don't expect them to sell $2,000 DVD players but I thought they'd have some selection for stuff in the $500 price range, say like the Denon 2200 or the Pansonic RP-82 and X30's.


Wouldn't you think that all those nice RPTV's and plasmas and HDVT's and LCD sets would make selling a more upscale model pretty easy?


BTW, I just found this site this week and I want to thank all the people here esp. the Vets and Experts who graciousley spend their time here. Many of them address the questions put by novices like myself, rather than just conversing in techno-complexities with fellow experts.


I know I appreciate the education, even if my head is still spinning! Thanks, guys!
 

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I think there are a couple of factors:


1. Those huge chains rely upon volume for profit. A lot of what they sell (but not all) is priced with razor thin profit margins. Higher priced items move less and cost more to aquire, so they are a higher risk financially to stock. Most people believe that a DVD player is a DVD player and buy the cheapest that they can live with. My coworkers think I am 100% insane for spending $1000 on a DVD player. Just look at the number of people in these forums saying things like "I can spend a maximum of $300 on a DVD player", then you find out they are showing the DVD player output on a $5000 LCD panel, or a $5000 front projector. It boggles the mind.


2. A lot of mid to high end DVD players are "boutique" brands; That is, brands that are normally sold by smaller specialty shops. Denon for example has normally been a brand that you'd only find at smaller retailers. Years ago, you'd never find Denon at a big chain. Sadly, here in South Florida, there are only two places to get Denon: Custom installers who don't retail to the public, and Brandsmart USA: A regional chain store that is like a circus inside. It's the epitome of large chain retail sales. It pains me to give them money for Denon equipment, but I have no other choice locally.


That's how I see it. Anyone else?


Brian.
 

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Other factors:

The stores would actually have to calibrate their TV's in order for customers to see the difference.


Also, it seems that some of the high end players have some usuability / compatibility issues that would be a support nightmare with the general public.
 

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There is no demand I am sure....


I am surprised any one ever buys a CRT based RPTV from CC or Best Buy, they are so badly setup it is amazing. Yesterday I went in to check out the replacement model for my Hitachi 51swx20b... and the convergence was so bad their were red halos to one side (3/8" over!!!) DNR and VSM were on, contrast at 100%. It was so horrible...then the DLP set next to it. Looked awesome, no convergence issues obviously, nice and bright...but when the camera panned, ouch again, screen door effect, shimmering....


Now given my experience, I can't see any difference between a $2000 Denon 5900 and a $20 Apex on TVs like these....which is what Joe Consumer who buys DVD players their would be gauging it on
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Good points, guys.


In the NY area, there aren't any Tweeters or Good Guys (I presume their local to Calif.). We've got CC, BB, and PC Richard.


You're right about the low margins; that's why places like Crazy Eddie, Newmark & Lewis, etc all went out. My point is: after someone has spent $2,000-$7,000 on a set, and then maybe another $500-$1,500 for a moderate acoustic setup, it should be really easy to tell that person "Hey, you'd be an idiot to use that with a $100 DVD." Believe it or not, I know people doing lots of research and spending money on the TV, then on the speakers, and then they have an under $200 (even under $100!) DVD. Needless to say, they haven't been around this site.


I just came back from CC. Their little acoustic room has some pretty decent speaker setups (nothing comparable to what folks here have, but a nice upgrade from TV speakers or $200 setups): Kenwood, Harmon Karmon, etc. Most from $600-$1,000. So again, it seems like the only place they are super-chintzy is on the DVD players.


If they can talk people into warranties, they should be able to talk 'em into a more useful DVD player, no? :)
 

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They used to carry those great old Panasonics but they were discontinued almost a year ago when Panasonic switched to only cheaper models, so that isn't the stores fault. Now the great FAroudja-based models are the domain of higher-end manufacturers like Denon that don't retail sell thru those lower-end chain stores only upper-end stores like Tweeter and Good Guys. Its expected that Joe6-pack types go to Best Buy, if you want higher qualtiy and more expensive stuff you should be shopping at other stores.


Tweeter and Good Guys are nation-wide chains not just west coast.

Of course New York has a lot of other stores that carry Denon like 6th Avenue.


I see a couple Tweeter stores listed on their website in New York:


ALBANY Tweeter:

161 Washington Ave. Ext.

Albany, NY 12205


SARATOGA SPRINGS Tweeter:

3072 Rt. 50

Saratoga Springs, NY 12866
 

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Add to all the reasons posted above, The sales staff would require far more training to be able to understand and sell high-end products. It just does'nt fit the big chain's business model.
 

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Actuly, BB does sell high-end auido and video through their "Magnolia HI-Fi" stores (now called Magnolia Auidio & Video). They bought them early last year to have a stake in this niche. However, I do believe that this is mainly a west-coast operation being that Magnolia's HQ are in the Washington state area.
 

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CC does sell H/K DVD players and they are considered a step up in both video and audio quality over the lower end mass market stuff they usually carry.


Dsmith
 

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Tweeters and Good Guys are not in the NYC area. The two stores listed are upstate on another planet. They may as well be in Fresno. BB only in the last year or two opened in the city.


The one mass-market store in NYC that had upper end DVDs was the Wiz. They went under after renovating a bunch of the stores with comfortable viewing areas. I would only go into their flagship 5th Avenue store as the others were pretty sleazy.


I'm pretty sure Magnolia started in Seattle's Magnolia neighborhood and then moved/expanded into the U district on Roosevelt with the other few Hi-fi stores back in the 70s/80s.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by bigtvluvr
someone has spent $2,000-$7,000 on a set,

...

then they have an under $200 (even under $100!) DVD.
Hey, I resemble that comment! I have a $2500 TV (sony 34 xbr910) and a $39 dvd player!


I'm still shopping for a dvd player. Unfortunately I have a CC $150 gift card (from tv purchase) and CC's selection is crappy. I'm hoping something there is good enough.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by blgentry
Most people believe that a DVD player is a DVD player and buy the cheapest that they can live with. My coworkers think I am 100% insane for spending $1000 on a DVD player. Brian.
$1k for a dvd player? i think you're insane too :p


RE: nyc not having tweeter, good guys, etc.. this is so true :( it isn't until just recently that we even had a BB!


although to be fair.. we do have stereoexchange, b&h, etc etc etc so we do have purty durn tootin good 'stores' here too :D
 

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If BB or CC is your only option for buying a dvd palyer locally then why not pick up a dvd recorder? Typically these make for outstanding PLAYERS as well and if I'm thinking correctly don't the Philips models that BB carries use the almighty Faroujda.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by blgentry
Sadly, here in South Florida, there are only two places to get Denon: Custom installers who don't retail to the public, and Brandsmart USA: A regional chain store that is like a circus inside. It's the epitome of large chain retail sales.
Yeah I'm surprised Denon is sold at Brandsmart. The salesmen don't even know what they are selling! I think Audio Advisor used to sell Denon as well but not anymore. It seems what is left there is old-stock. About custom installer I would give it a try, I phoned one yesterday and he had no problem taking an order.;)
 

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There is a lack of quality DVD players in the 300-400 range. Thats a problem. With speakers, there is a nice curve of money and quality going hand in hand and you get a bit of that at Best Buy or CC. With DVD players, its the entry level or spend a little more money than you want to. There really should be a quality DVD player at 300-400 that is equivalent to the Panny line that was discontinued ( hell- my XP30 only cost 189).


You dont have to spend 1000 for a decent speaker, and the fact that you have to do that for a "secrets approved" DVD player stinks. Lower price = more sales, but I can see BB moving a 300 dollar player.
 

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Quality depends on the manufacturer. You can get a good DVD player for about 200 dollars. It may roll off a little more video resolution than say a 500 or more player, but just because it's 200 dollars does not mean that it isn't a good player. I believe that the reason you don't see BB or CC selling dvd players that cost more than 200 dollars is because the average person that walks into one of those stores is not going to spend 3,000 for a television and then 800 for a dvd player.


We have Sound Advice and high end independently home theater stores here in JAX and they tend to sell players that start at 500 or more. I went into Sound Advice today and they had a very nice Pioneer Elite 59 avi but it was 800 dollars. None of the players I saw were less than 500. They also had 10,000 dollar plasmas, speakers starting at 1,000 each and 8,000 amps. At a store like Sound Advice that is what you would expect but at CC or BB I don't expect them to sell a high price player because in those stores it won't move as fast.
 

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I would like to suggest that the upcoming transition to wide scale digital signaling between the DVD player and the display/receiver/switcher will turn the DVD player cost slope inside out.


Whether DVI-D or HDMI (or Firewire), once the cost of decent analog electronics is stripped out of the upcoming generation of DVD player's cost structure, and enough of this new generation of players properly handle the CUE and other now-well-understood problems, I think the things that are important for high quality DVD playback will be present in many/most of those players which will be selling for sub-$200.


If DVI and HDMI take off the way they could, in short order we should see lots of relatively cheap DVD players with the focus on digital (DVI-D/HDMI/Firewire) output. The analog outputs that would be present would be for legacy compatibility, and would not be a competitive feature. I can see digital output only players appearing as soon as there are sufficient display devices with digital inputs.


The next generation of expensive DVD players might continue to include decent analog electronics, but they are going to be playing a weaker competitive hand if the "cheap" stuff can produce truly decent playback - which is possible because it is all digital and high volume.


Players like the Bravo series, the Momitsu, and other Sigma chipset players seem to be the core of the future for DVD playback. All it takes is one DVD chipset company to get it "right", and pump those chipsets out in volume.


I suspect that by the time High Definition DVD players become mainstream, analog outputs will be a niche market, and digital outputs will be the focus.


All of this is my opinion, of course, and we have all seen things not work out they way one would expect, especially in consumer electronics.
 

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I'm puzzled. I understand the desire for buying locally, but what's wrong with buying from an on-line store? I did my research and decided on the DVD player that I wanted. None of the local stores carried what I wanted and the local Hi-Fi and specialty stores didn't have it either, besides being out of line with prices.


I went on-line and got what I wanted for a reasonable price. I also researched the reputation of the web store before ordering. I got real good service and price and the player that I wanted for about 75% of the MSRP.
 
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