AVS Forum banner
1 - 20 of 21 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
900 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Using a large outdoor antenna for OTA broadcast to my UHD TV sets. The signal was intermittently weak so I purchased a $30 four way splitter, Monster Cable Ultra-high Performance Ultra Low Loss, Extended Bandwidth, 5 MHz to 2 GHz.

LINK: http://www.thriftcat.org/upc/050644455957/monster-cable-tghz4rf-mkii-2

Outside of the box indicates made in China, inside label attached to the splitter "Made in Taiwan".

This device comes with five plain rubber protective caps and three gold metal caps with have a male coax terminal, BUT there are absolutely no directions on when and where to use these metal caps. Called Monster tech support and they had no idea how and if to use these metal caps or terminators!!

Please help - - - - when and where to use the metal terminal end pieces ? There is one input and four outputs, so if using only two of the outs do these metal end pieces go on the unused two outs ? If so, why ? What happens if one caps the unused outs with the rubber end pieces ? Does performance go down ?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,656 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,656 Posts
Great...
You still should consider Option 3.

If you only need two drops, even when using a 4-way splitter with properly terminated unused ports you're still losing half the signal power.

Hope this helped. ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
900 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Something from the past... hope it helps:
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/25-hd...-terminators-unused-cable-rg6-rf-outlets.html

EDIT:
1) You overpaid for the splitter
2) The splitter has nothing to do with UHD.
3) if you only need 2 splits... use a 2-way splitter.
4) OTA signals are not 5MHz to 2GHz.
4) if signal is intermittent... it's probably the antenna (or setup/cabling/etc.)

Thank you, Ratman. Answers:

1. It was the lowest price of this Monster, lower than on the Internet.
2. Have no idea, but this expensive splitter is definitely associated with resolution of the problem. There is no more "no signal", no more digital break-up. This single change of the splitter has worked. Now, if you think that the Monster splitter is way overpriced, then of course you are correct. Monster produces everything overpriced from a consumer point of view. Monster doesn't think their products are overpriced. The fact that the issue is resolved saves a monster-hassle of the cable leading to the large roof antenna and the antenna itself.
3. Need four splits, so this model is fine. Just haven't added the two other cable ends.
4. OTA signals are what frequency ? Are you excluding that this Monster might have helped the OTA transmissions ?
5. Yes, the break up was intermittent but changing the splitter has resolved the problem… so far.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
900 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Great...
You still should consider Option 3.

If you only need two drops, even when using a 4-way splitter with properly terminated unused ports you're still losing half the signal power.

Hope this helped. ;)


How much loss occurs as a consequence of two used and two terminated outs ?

The store only has 3 out and 4 out Monsters, not 2 out Monsters.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,656 Posts
1) no need to pay more for Mon$ter products.
2) Any 2-way or new splitter of less expense would probably resolved you issue(s).
3) great. You never mentioned the intent to add new drops.
4) From Wiki: Over-the-air television channels are divided into two bands: the VHF band which comprises channels 2 through 13 and occupies frequencies between 54 and 216 MHz, and the UHF band, which comprises channels 14 through 83 and occupies frequencies between 470 and 890 MHz.
5) So a new splitter resolved your issue... that's good. But IMO, it's not because it's a Mon$ter splitter. ;)

Not trying to be snarky... but lose that Mon$ter is the best mentality.

As for splitters... terminated or not, 3.5 dB loss per output with 2-way. 7 dB for 4-way.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
900 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
1) no need to pay more for Mon$ter products.
2) Any 2-way or new splitter of less expense would probably resolved you issue(s).
3) great. You never mentioned the intent to add new drops.
4) From Wiki: Over-the-air television channels are divided into two bands: the VHF band which comprises channels 2 through 13 and occupies frequencies between 54 and 216 MHz, and the UHF band, which comprises channels 14 through 83 and occupies frequencies between 470 and 890 MHz.
5) So a new splitter resolved your issue... that's good. But IMO, it's not because it's a Mon$ter splitter. ;)

Not trying to be snarky... but lose that Mon$ter is the best mentality.

As for splitters... terminated or not, 3.5 dB loss per output with 2-way. 7 dB for 4-way.


Is that a significant signal loss ?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,656 Posts
Is that a significant signal loss ?
Well... each "split" halves the signal power. Each halving of power results in ~ -3 dB loss.

No splitter = 100% of the available signal power
2-way splitter = 50% of the available signal power to each side (~ -3.5 dB)
4-way splitter = 25% signal power for each output (~ -7 dB)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,728 Posts
Whether you call the insertion loss through a splitter significant totally depends on the signal level going into the splitter and what comes out. If, after a splitter, you have good pictures, the loss is not significant.

Don't get hung up on the "half-the-power" thing. For most of us end-users, it's a waste of time. At an output port of a 4-way splitter, I have a signal level of 6dBmV, which means that at the input I have a signal level of ~13dBmV. Why is it so important for me to know that at the input I have 4 times the power? It's something that you don't use and can just end up being confusing. If you're a design engineer, however, that is something you need to know.

Ratman was just pointing that replacing the splitter with a $6 Holland splitter would have given you the same results as the $30 Monster splitter.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
900 Posts
Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Whether you call the insertion loss through a splitter significant totally depends on the signal level going into the splitter and whatcomes out. If, after a splitter, you have good pictures, the loss is not significant.

Don't get hung up on the "half-the-power" thing. For most of us end-users, it's a waste of time. At an output port of a 4-way splitter, I have a signal level of 6dBmV, which means that at the input I have a signal level of ~13dBmV. Why is it so important for me to know that at the input I have 4 times the power? It's something that you don't use and can just end up being confusing. If you're a design engineer, however, that is something you need to know.

Ratman was just pointing that replacing the splitter with a $6 Holland splitter would have given you the same results as the $30 Monster splitter.

Thanks. Then why do people purchase expensive over-priced Monster splitters and why do people buy them ?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,728 Posts
Thanks. Then why do people purchase expensive over-priced Monster splitters and why do people buy them ?
Marketing. Plus, many people have the idea that if it costs more it's better.

Just like with videotapes -- Betamax was superior, but VHS was, by far, the most popular.

It's all in the hype, not the product.

If you took a poll of CATV technicians who have merely replaced a Monster splitter to resolve an issue, you would be amazed at the percentage who have done just that.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,656 Posts
Just to be clear...
Ratman was trying to convey that Mon$ter products are overpriced and no better than most splitters.
Secondly, if you only need a 2-way splitter, don't use a 4-way splitter.
And the "power" thing was as generic I could be to someone that doesn't understand the basics. Just trying to help without being overly confusing. ;)

Just asking:
What is the best and easiest (least expensive) way for an "antenna only" user to measure dBmV to verify? :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,728 Posts
Agreed 100%

Unfortunately, there isn't an inexpensive solution for ATSC measurements. There are cheap signal strength "meters," but they only tell you if the signal is low/high -- not the actual signal levels. You can't even tune to individual channels with those.

To get actual levels, you have to go with a commercial meter, at a cost of ~$419 or so.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,656 Posts
And... therefore my "generic" explanation for the OP. :D

You never know, maybe the old splitter was good and perhaps there's just a marginal/intermittent coax connector and reseating or moving the cables "fixed" the problem. ;)

IMHO... there could be numerous explanations and/or recommendations. We all try to do the best we can to help out.
Tough job being a back seat driver, Monday monrning quarterback or Carnac the Magnificent.:p
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,538 Posts
Thanks. Then why do people purchase expensive over-priced Monster splitters and why do people buy them ?
Got Beats headphones? Bose speakers? An iPad (or iPhone)? Like Monster these are all number ones because of marketing, not because they're the best. I bought a Foxconn bare bones system for $63 (brand new) that is essentially the same as a mac mini (made in the same factory, same components)... :D
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,656 Posts
Oh, I'd take Carnac the Magnificent anyday! I do miss him. :rolleyes:
And Ed McMahon:
"I have in my hand an envelope, a child of four can plainly see these envelopes are hermetically sealed. They've been kept since noon today in a mayonnaise jar on Funk & Wagnalls' porch. No one-but one!-knows the contents. In his mystical, and borderline way; Carnac will now ascertain the answers having never heard the questions."
 
  • Like
Reactions: egnlsn

·
Registered
Joined
·
900 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 ·
If the issue recurs - - - - -

And Ed McMahon:


Carnac, the outdoor antenna is 30 years old. Do antennas "go bad" as they age ?

If this problem recurs, I shall directly connect a set to the antenna coax drop to see if there's an issue then. The two downstairs sets have two intervening coax runs down a wall to the first level.
 
1 - 20 of 21 Posts
Top