Why use DVI on a CRT?

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Jay,


Getting back to your original question - if you read through the Moome card thread(s) for example, almost everyone says the picture they get from DVI is better than what they have been viewing. The problem is that without a DVI card that completes the HDCP handshake, you can't use the DVI outputs of your source equipment into an analog CRT projector. Most people have had to use RGBHV or component outputs up to this point and both of these are analog signals.


So even if you don't plan on buying an HD-DVD or Blu-Ray player, there are still, and will continue to be, DVI (and HDMI) sources that will need a DVI card in order to be used with a CRT projector.


HTH

I'm sure that someone will correct my statements if what I say is wrong but is not DVI limited to just a few meters between source and projector? I thought that I read somewhere that it is only twisted pair cables. You can get much longer distance between your components with coax cable.


You have to have dual link DVI for 1080p. One link doesn't have the bandwidth.


One of the big reasons for DVI is the projector can inform the source of it's native resolution/special settings. Kinda like plug and play. It makes life with digital projectors easier. CRT projectors don't need that kind of stuff.


The movie makers want a completely encripted, digital signal chain. They are being hurt by pirating. They would rather have no analog signal anywhere in the chain. I think if they had their way we CRTers would have no video sources at all.


I don't see any reason for DVI and CRT at all except that's the only way you are going to get any modern video. It is no improvement over a decent analog source for your CRT projector.

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Pretty much, but not exactly. Neither HD-DVD nor BD require down rezzed analog output, they support it. They both support full resolution output via analog. They both also implement a down rez flag that if present will output down rezzed analog output. In other words, it is completely up to the studio whether you get full rez or down rezzed analog. A couple studios have already said they will support full rez analog output. Rumor has it that there are a few studios that will do full rez analog output because they do not want to punish early adopters. Rumor also has it that there are some studios that are very anti-full rez analog and plan to use the flag.


Simple fact is that not allowing full-rez analog will do nothing to stop real pirating operations. It will not be that hard to buy an HD CRT direct view and use its guts to get an analog signal to record (once the require 4 GHz processors are available). This is of course assume HDCP is not cracked, which according to one encryption expert is not that hard to do at all.


Bottom line, disallowing full rez analog output won't stop real pirating operations. Mostly it will just hurt us, the honest consumer who doesn't yet want to use an inferior display technology.


For more info about all the issues connected with HD on disc see:
http://www.dvdsite.org/


Dave

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True, but the jury has not returned on the present state of DVI to analog conversion. Many has claimed that they are getting "great" images from DVI to RGB conversion. What we've seen, and it's pretty much lines up with what Curt had reported from his evaluation, is that the image is worse than analog RGB.


In my evaluations (as also witnessed by many others), this was observed with each of the units tested. And we looked at almost every known one of them out there. The DVI idea/design is a good one. But I think it needs some time to get better, because it should at least be better than than analog RGB. Curt had mentioned color saturation and hues. This was also my same observation, to include lack of real detail in backgrounds. We even noticed this at Clarence's on his G90, and he had also mentioned in his post on my visit that his DVI converter (not the Moome's unit) did not do too well with the HDTV resolution pattern. I know things are changing and that we'll more likely have to go all the way for DVI conversion, but I sure hope someone does something better with the conversion.


I've yet to look at Moome's unit via DVI (but hope to when JBJR comes down). I have however seen it component to RGB. Other than what Curt had reported, I've read very good things so far. I only hope that the colors are truly correct, to include some other observations that I've noticed from some of the others.


The best HDTV I've seen so far, seems to have come from a laptop playing ts files. Everything about that image was perfect. Colrs were vibrant, as they should be with HDTV, and the background detail was very clear and distinct. And even at higher resolutions. The true essence of HDTV is fine detail and colors.


So for now, they seem to be OK, affordable and a very good option for DVI conversion. however, I do hope Moome's is better than what I've already seen so far, because we'll need something really good for for high def on our high performing 9" CRT projectors. It really would be great to get around the shortcomings of analog cabling/etc.

Well I would like to add that DVI performance does seem to depend on source as well. ( as one might suspect.)


In Using the Moome card in my sony 1272 I have noticed that:


When I hooked the Comcast Moto 6412 box by HDMI that it was a bit less saturated than comp out, but when I use the JVC 5U DVHS deck with HDMI the colors are noticeably more saturated and sharper than comp. (note comp looks the same between the two boxes).


I do look forward to what you find when you do get to try out one of the input cards, Mike!


Thanks!


Brian

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This is really bad news for us high end CRT users.. I was hoping things did not turn out this way with DVI conversion.. I'm also hoping that some chip manufacturer would take us to the next level with higher performance chips. and for some reason, I'm very optomistic that it will happen for us, because what I've been seeing is NOT what I want to be seeing in my HT. because with HDTV, the real virtues are bandwidth and resolution. For Video (movies,etc) this translates to detailed and sharp backgrounds, and improved colors. Yes, resolution and bandwidth has a big effect on colors:


With good DVD and other SDTV performance video. When there's six people in a room of the same race or complexion, you should be able to see the differences in at least three of their complexions.


With good HDTV. when there's six people in a room of the same race or complexion, you should be able see the differences in at least five of their complexions, to include sometimes being able to see the makeup on their faces.


With the inabilty to discern the super detail in the backgrounds, to include the amazing color pallete of pastel colors that's so pungent with HDTV, we're not really getting TRUE HDTV..



btw, the MP-5 will not be listed on my website with the site changes next month. Our focus next year will shift to another direction.