[danc24]

I just read this article:

http://www.businessinsider.com/why-d...-8-2011-8?op=1


It basically speculates that since Dolby support is being dropped from Windows, WMC will either be removed from Windows 8 or revamped to focus more on Internet streaming instead of DVD playback.


I'm a WMC fan and currently use WM7 for DVD playback along with a Ceton card installed for cable. Obviously I can continue using WM7 for years to come, but what impact will dropping Dolby have on future WMC's? Does it change anyone's expected use?

 

[Nevcairiel]

Internet streams potentally also use Dolby audio. Dropping Dolby support would not only kill DVDs, but also TV and streaming.


In any case, its potentially still possible to use a 3rd party decoder, as it is today.

 

[pittsoccer33]

what does this mean for people who "passthrough/bitstream" surround sound?


even plenty of internet video has dolby digital.

 

[gtgray]

I would not be surprised if this is not an argument about the price. Dolby is used almost exclusively in both Terrestrial and Cable Television. I am very sceptical this will be the outcome.. Win 7 will be around a long time in any case.

 

[jhoff80]

Maybe it's a negotiation about the price, but either way it's a step in the wrong direction. Microsoft should be adding codec support, not taking it away.


If Windows 8 doesn't have mkv, webM, Dolby TrueHD, DTS-MA, x264, and Blu-ray support built in, that's just stupid, in my opinion.


I know they've been consistently behind the ball on codecs, but Windows 8 would be a great time to change that.

 

[Nevcairiel]

There are really high licensing requirements for alot of these codecs, i doubt Microsoft will fully support Blu-rays or any of the HD audio content, as the licensing would bring up the price for a feature only very few people will use.

 

[GreenEyez]

Too bad most new Blu Rays are getting DTS-HD instead of Dolby TrueHD. Dolby itself seems more like a dying company. DTS is superior to DD in terms of quality, and DTS-HD as mentioned above seems to be the preffered lossless format for most disks coming out. I don`t think by the time Windows 8 comes out Dolby is going to be much of a problem.

 

[GreenEyez]



Quote:
Originally Posted by jhoff80 /forum/post/20803891


Maybe it's a negotiation about the price, but either way it's a step in the wrong direction. Microsoft should be adding codec support, not taking it away.


If Windows 8 doesn't have mkv, webM, Dolby TrueHD, DTS-MA, x264, and Blu-ray support built in, that's just stupid, in my opinion.


I know they've been consistently behind the ball on codecs, but Windows 8 would be a great time to change that.

x264 is an encoder, not a codec. h.264 is the codec and Windows 7 has a H.264/VC-1 DXVA decoder built in. You can playback a m2ts file out of the box just fine.


As for MKV, i doubt MS will support a container that is so widely used in piracy.

 

[gorthocar]

I read a different article about the same topic, and they were predicting that you'll still be able to bitstream DD in the W8 out of the box media player & media center, but you won't be licensed to decode it and output it as PCM. Third party players can license Dolby if they want to decode. That would be perfectly fine with me.


How many times do they really expect me to pay Dolby to decode the audio one time? When you buy W7, they get paid. MSFT is so anti-Blu that we'll always have to pay a 3rd party for BD playback software, which includes Dolby licenses. When you buy an AV receiver, they've licensed Dolby and get paid again. My TV can decode DD, so I'm sure Dolby got paid for that as well. When I've upgraded from ArcSoft TMT 2 to 3 to 5, I'm sure they got paid again and again. Enough is enough!


I'm probably arguing over a few pennies, but does anybody know the actual price or savings?

 

[jeffkro]



Quote:
Originally Posted by danc24 /forum/post/20802905


I just read this article:

http://www.businessinsider.com/why-d...-8-2011-8?op=1


It basically speculates that since Dolby support is being dropped from Windows, WMC will either be removed from Windows 8 or revamped to focus more on Internet streaming instead of DVD playback.


I'm a WMC fan and currently use WM7 for DVD playback along with a Ceton card installed for cable. Obviously I can continue using WM7 for years to come, but what impact will dropping Dolby have on future WMC's? Does it change anyone's expected use?

This only applies to WM7 correct? So if you use XBMC or power dvd it will still work just fine wont it? I can't see why they would remove a very useful feature that they have already taken the time and money to make.

 

[sneals2000]



Quote:
Originally Posted by gtgray /forum/post/20803410


I would not be surprised if this is not an argument about the price. Dolby is used almost exclusively in both Terrestrial and Cable Television. I am very sceptical this will be the outcome.. Win 7 will be around a long time in any case.

In the US it is.


In Europe MP2 is the basic standard audio codec for MPEG2 SD Digital TV broadcasts, with Dolby only really used for the few SD channels using 5.1 - where it is usually broadcast as a secondary stream.


Dolby is the mainstream standard for the main audio for HDTV satellite and cable broadcasts in Europe - which are mainly H264 aka MPEG4 for video. However it is common for a secondary MP2 stereo stream to be present for broadcaster-mixed audio description (aka narrative audio)


However OTA HD (and OTA SD using H264 instead of MPEG2) in Europe is a mix of Dolby and AAC. (The UK OTA HD system uses H264 1080i with HE-AAC for the main 2.0/5.1 audio streams. Norway, New Zealand, Sweden are all using some AAC for their OTA digital TV as well)


One problem that has caused a switch away from Dolby to AAC in some regions is that Dolby were late developing a "receiver mix" audio description system. (Where the receiver mixes, with dipping and panning and user control of the relative levels, a low bitrate narration stream - containing just the additional narration stream - with a high bitrate programme stream containing the regular programme sound stream)

 

[sneals2000]



Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffkro /forum/post/20805241


This only applies to WM7 correct? So if you use XBMC or power dvd it will still work just fine wont it? I can't see why they would remove a very useful feature that they have already taken the time and money to make.

Presumably it is to reduce costs. Dolby will charge a licensing fee for the rights to distribute a Dolby Digital decoder with Windows, and MS presumably don't want to pay this to reduce their unit costs. If only a relatively small percentage of Windows installs play Dolby encoded content and thus use the decoder then MS will presumably feel that is a wasted cost?


XBMC and other open source software presumably doesn't pay this licence fee, and hope not to get sued? Think Boxee and others who have commercial products based on XBMC will be paying a Dolby (and DTS) licence fee ; ISTR that a recent change to the way Boxee handled some Dolby audio was related to this?

 

[sneals2000]



Quote:
Originally Posted by gorthocar /forum/post/20804229


I read a different article about the same topic, and they were predicting that you'll still be able to bitstream DD in the W8 out of the box media player & media center, but you won't be licensed to decode it and output it as PCM. Third party players can license Dolby if they want to decode. That would be perfectly fine with me.


How many times do they really expect me to pay Dolby to decode the audio one time? When you buy W7, they get paid. MSFT is so anti-Blu that we'll always have to pay a 3rd party for BD playback software, which includes Dolby licenses. When you buy an AV receiver, they've licensed Dolby and get paid again. My TV can decode DD, so I'm sure Dolby got paid for that as well. When I've upgraded from ArcSoft TMT 2 to 3 to 5, I'm sure they got paid again and again. Enough is enough!


I'm probably arguing over a few pennies, but does anybody know the actual price or savings?

Lets hope they fix the ludicrous Dolby bitstreaming bug that we've had for years then...

(If you configure your HDMI audio output for 5.1 - to get non-Dolby audio streams like AAC decoded to 5.1 PCM - but configure your PC to output Dolby and DTS as bitstreams - Media Center usually goes haywire with Dolby audio. To get this to work you either have to leave your PC to decode - which is fine with Dolby but not DTS out-of-the-box - or configure your speakers for 2.0 and put up with stereo PCM output of 5.1 AAC sources)

 

[evilengineer]

This may be stating the obvious, but what's to stop Microsoft selling you a "DVD pack" or even the whole of Media Center as an Appstore purchase?


It has the double advantage for Microsoft of saving them a few cents on all those corporate installs while at the same time allowing them to charge an extra $2.99 (or whatever) for something that previously came "free" to all those people that would like to watch DVDs on their PC.

 

[Artslinger]



Quote:
Originally Posted by evilengineer /forum/post/20805908


This may be stating the obvious, but what's to stop Microsoft selling you a "DVD pack" or even the whole of Media Center as an Appstore purchase?


It has the double advantage for Microsoft of saving them a few cents on all those corporate installs while at the same time allowing them to charge an extra $2.99 (or whatever) for something that previously came "free" to all those people that would like to watch DVDs on their PC.

I agree I'm thinking you will be able to purchase apps for all kinds of things even bluray support.

 

[gorthocar]



Quote:
Originally Posted by sneals2000 /forum/post/20805828


Lets hope they fix the ludicrous Dolby bitstreaming bug that we've had for years then...

(If you configure your HDMI audio output for 5.1 - to get non-Dolby audio streams like AAC decoded to 5.1 PCM - but configure your PC to output Dolby and DTS as bitstreams - Media Center usually goes haywire with Dolby audio. To get this to work you either have to leave your PC to decode - which is fine with Dolby but not DTS out-of-the-box - or configure your speakers for 2.0 and put up with stereo PCM output of 5.1 AAC sources)

Yes, that is an annoying bug that is long overdue to be fixed. It makes me wonder if anybody at MSFT is actually using W7MC in a HTPC. I'm working around that bug by disabling navigation sounds in W7MC, which will let me keep my speakers set to 5.1 while live ATSC bitstreams DD.

 

[Mike_Boulanger]



Quote:
This may be stating the obvious, but what's to stop Microsoft selling you a "DVD pack" or even the whole of Media Center as an Appstore purchase?


It has the double advantage for Microsoft of saving them a few cents on all those corporate installs while at the same time allowing them to charge an extra $2.99 (or whatever) for something that previously came "free" to all those people that would like to watch DVDs on their PC.

I hope they do that. I wouldn't mind them charging for WMC, especially if they update it more consistently! But I hope they see enough sales to justify improvements.

 

[walford]

CODEC stands for Coder and Decoder so when you get the Codec you get both the Coder code and it's corresponding Decoder code see:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Codec

 

[babgvant]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevcairiel /forum/post/20802963


Internet streams potentally also use Dolby audio. Dropping Dolby support would not only kill DVDs, but also TV and streaming.

Microsoft only licenses DD decoding for its applications, so the only impact will be for applications like WMP and 7MC (AFAIK Silverlight does not support DD or DD+ currently). Streaming playback is usually handled by a 3rd party application (like Flash) which would not be covered anyway.

 

[brianjb]

Has anyone installed the Windows 8 beta? I am wondering if they made any changes to WMC yet, or if the beta build even includes WMC.