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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I've had my X1 for about six weeks now, and generally, I think it is pretty good. Rainbows are kind of bothering to me, but I'm really trying to just ignore them.


However, I've come across another problem now that is not so easy to ignore. In fast moving scenes, it almost appears as if the picture is stuttering. I noticed this first watching Daredevil, in fast moving fight scenes, and last night I noticed it in the first major fight scene in Gladiator. It almost looks like frames are being dropped, causing the picture not to look fluid.


I am hooked up from an older Toshiba DVD player through component outs in progressive mode.


Anyone else noticed a problem like this?


Shawn
 

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What you are probably seeing is in the DVD itself. Movies are shot at 24 frames per second, and when the camera quickly pans across images you get what is known as "judder" which is a stuttering caused by the fact that the frame rate is so slow compared to the video rate of 60 fields per second.
 

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for a test, try letting the X1's deinterlacer take a crack at the job -- feed it the image via Svideo. it it's markedly better then you might shop for a new DVD player w/ a great deinterlacer and w/o the chroma bug.


Mark
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by spmorgan
I noticed this first watching Daredevil, in fast moving fight scenes, and last night I noticed it in the first major fight scene in Gladiator. It almost looks like frames are being dropped, causing the picture not to look fluid.
Shawn,

I might be stating the obvious here, but he first battle scene at the beginning of Gladiator is actually filmed this way (towards the end of it, to be precise)

It looks like the frames are being dropped because they are.

This has nothing to do with the X1 and it is a part of the movie.

I don't know about Daredevil - I didn't see it yet.

:)
 

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I've noticed this problem also. 'Lagging' movement and seemingly dropped frames. Very annoying, and I have neither Gladiator nor Daredevil.


I notice it on LOTR, both films, but other films as well. I think it's dependent on the player and doesn't involve the X1 at all (tho I have no way to be sure), but I can't explain what's happening. Somewhere the scaling is 'slow' and just can't keep up, it seems. It doesn't matter what mode I'm using, either.


My newest JVC XV-N50BK player is REALLY bad in this regard (it does NOT have a Faroudja chip). Still scratching my head as to how to deal with it. I hate to take it back, because I like the fine color adjustments.


I've upgraded the X1 to the latest firmware, but it didn't help the situation at all. May even have made it worse. It makes no difference if I check the 'sync' box in the menu, either.


Ron Yost
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Now that you mention it, I'm pretty sure I noticed it while watching LOTR TT as well.


I'll try it through S-Video tonight (although I may have already tried that on Daredevil, and I think it was still doing the same thing). I also have another DVD player I could try, although its a cheaper one, but newer.


Shawn
 

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Yes, TT is realllllly bad. All those long pans are destroyed by the 'stuttering'. Something's happening .. now, what causes it??


Ron Yost
 

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Sometimes with my JVC progressive scan DVD player, if I fast forward a little bit and start watching the video again, I notice the same thing you describe, which is almost like the X1 is dropping frames. Fortunately it doesn't happen very often, but for me what helps is rewinding a little bit. Sometimes this gets it working OK. Like I said, it doesn't happen very often, and it seems like fast forwarding is the trigger.


BTW, this problem is usually less with progressive scan players.
 

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Maybe the newest JVC players just suck?? Think I'll take mine back. I hooked up my 'old' Pioneer progressive player and it plays LOTR-TT just fine. I miss the gamma control of the JVC tho.


Ron Yost
 

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can't say enough about trying an Svideo test ...


Mark
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I tried S-Video last night, and it did the same thing. So, I guess its either the X1 or my DVD player. Not sure what to do now.


Shawn
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by spmorgan
I tried S-Video last night, and it did the same thing. So, I guess its either the X1 or my DVD player. Not sure what to do now.


Shawn
I doubt it is the X1. Try hooking up your player to the TV and playing the same scene on the DVD.
 

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I experienced the same problem with my JVC XV-N44SL. There was a short thread about it in the DVD forum.


The problem was definately with the JVC. The funny thing is that you can view the same scene a few times, and it will not 'stutter' every time. To me, it seemed like a bandwidth/caching issue..or some sort of processing that could not keep up with framerate.


I believe the JVC has some sort of setting that lets you select the picture source (Auto, Film, Video(Normal), Video(Active)). "Active" being a video source with a lot of movement. I remember switching between these settings definately made a difference, but did not fix the problem....picture quality was reduced when in Active mode from what I can remember.


In any event, I replaced the JVC with a Panasonic RP-62. Never had that problem again.


Good luck with it. If it weren't for that problem, I would have kept the JVC. It has color and gamma controls that help the X1's black level detail.


DT
 

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Yes DT1, I've experienced the same. I think JVC's done something to really cheapen the video driver section of their players. They're fussy about having more than one cable connected, for example .. now this 'sync' issue.


I've always had good luck with JVC products, so it's disappointing to find how badly the new units are performing. Is there a place to complain directly to JVC?? Do they listen??


It's a shame, as I, too, like the gamma control. Oh well. It's going back today. :(


Ron Yost
 

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I think the problem is related to NTSC sources because 24 fps need to be converted to 60 shown fields, and that convertion inserts 1 more frame each 24.

Here with PAL we don't have that problem because they increase the original frame rate to 25 fps that is easily converted to 50 fields per second without inserting of droping frames. The drawback of this is that the same movie in PAL is shorter (in duration) that the same in NTSC. This can be more noticeable with the soundtrack because it is played with an higher pitch.


Jorge
 

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I've noticed this same problem with my Xbox lately very very annoying. I purchased a Component VGA box and I'm hoping it will fix my problems.
 

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I feed my X1 from a HTPC ATI Radeon 9600 Pro. I do notice very small but frequent micro stutters (sort of a very very small constant stutter) on slower pans. Is this the X1? All source is PAL here. Is it something to do with the PC being feed 60HZ?


I doesn't seem to do it on WM9 HD demos but, hmmm
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Well, since I didn't have another DVD player to try, I ordered a Denon 1600 and should get it this week. I'll let you know if it fixes the stutter problem.


Shawn
 
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