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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have been an Onkyo partisan for quite a while, but have been blown away by the audio quality of my most recent denon blu ray player. Needless, to say this range is looking celtic at the new denon avrs and thought I would start a thread dedicated to the comparison between the mid and higher part of the two line-ups:

MakeMSRPStreet*PowerCHTHDTHXHDMIWeightVideoWarrantyA DSXAudysseyPower
Denon AVR4810$2,999$2,999140 watts9.1.1.10.05%NA642lbsABT 20102 yearsXDynamic EQ, Dynamic Volume and MultEQ XT9.5a
Onkyo TX NR5007$2,699$2,494145 watts9.1.10.05%Ultra2855lbsReon HQV2 yearsXDynamic EQ, Dynamic Volume and MultEQ XT12.8a
Onkyo TX NR3007$2,099$1,894140 watts9.20.05%Ultra2755lbsReon HQV2 yearsXDynamic EQ, Dynamic Volume and MultEQ XT11.6a
Denon AVR4310$1,999$1,896130 watts7.10.05%NA635lbsABT 20102 yearsXDynamic EQ, Dynamic Volume and MultEQ XT8.1a
Onkyo TX NR1007$1,599$1,494135 watts9.20.05%Ultra2652lbsFarjouda2 yearsXMultEQ XT; Dynamic Volume; Dynamic EQ11.6a
Denon AVR3310$1,499$996120 watts7.10.05%None529lbsABT 20102 yearsDynamic EQ, Dynamic Volume and MultEQ7a
Marantz SR6004$1,249$1,249110 watts7.1UnknownNone428lbsUnknown3 yearsDynamic EQ, Dynamic Volume and MultEQ*5.4a
Onkyo TX NR807$1,099$699135 watts7.20.08%Select2640lbsFarjouda2 yearsXDynamic EQ, Dynamic Volume and MultEQ7.8a
Marantz SR5004$849$84990 watts7.1UnknownNA328lbsUnknown3 yearsDynamic EQ, Dynamic Volume and MultEQ*5.4a
Onkyo HT RC180$1,049$779110 watts7.20.08%Select2540lbsFarjouda2 yearsXDynamic EQ, Dynamic Volume and MultEQ7.8a
Onkyo TX SR707$899$529100 watts7.20.08%Select2628lbsFarjouda2 yearsXDynamic EQ, Dynamic Volume and MultEQ5.9a
Denon AVR2310$849$799105 watts7.10.08%NA529lbsABT 20102 yearsDynamic EQ, Dynamic Volume and MultEQ6a

*Audyssey cannot be used/applied for lossless audio codecs like Dolby TrueHD/DTS HD MA

On paper, the Onkyo seems to be pushing featureset, power, and DACs/THX certification.
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Using S&M Test Disc, outputting source direct from Marantz BD7004:


Using S&M's synthetic test disc, notably the racecar tests, here are the deinterlacing results using source direct from a bd player and letting the receivers do the work:

TestDenon AVR-2310ciPioneer KuroOnkyo TX NR1007Onkyo TX NR807Onkyo TX NR906Marantz SR6004
ABT 2010UnknownFarjouda DCDi CinemaFarjouda DCDi CinemaReon HQV VXI Chips
2:2PassFailFailFailPENDINGN/A**
2:2:2:4Pass*Pass*Pass*Pass*N/A**
2:3:2:3 (PF-T)PassPass*Pass*Pass*N/A**
2:3:2:3Passpass*PassPassN/A**
2:3:3:2Pass*Pass*Pass*Pass*N/A**
3:2:3:2:2PassFailFailFailN/A**
5:5PassMarginalFailFailN/A**
6:4PassMarginalFailFailN/A**
8:7PassPassFailFailN/A**
24p - passPassPassPassPassN/A**
Time-adjustedPassFailFailFailN/A**
Ship JaggiesPassMarginalMarginalMarginalN/A**

* denotes lock-on in second sequence

**Receiver lacks ability to scale digital signals
 

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There's really no doubt about it, the 807 is definitely one of the strongest contenders in the $1000 range for feature set and specs. I own a 875 and the 8xx series have always been built well (the 8x5 series even more so than the newer ones). I did find my 875 to run exceedingly hot so I was happy when my new Denon feels very cool to the touch. I chose Denon this time just because I knew it would work well with my combination of tv and source devices (since I had HDMI handshaking problems with my Onkyo)


Sound wise I feel Denon and Onkyo aren't far apart, they both sound good to my ears.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by warpdrive /forum/post/17046552


There's really no doubt about it, the 807 is definitely one of the strongest contenders in the $1000 range for feature set and specs. I own a 875 and the 8xx series have always been built well (the 8x5 series even more so than the newer ones). I did find my 875 to run exceedingly hot so I was happy when my new Denon feels very cool to the touch. I chose Denon this time just because I knew it would work well with my combination of tv and source devices (since I had handshaking problems with my Onkyo)

Onkyo seems to be a clear "on-paper" winner, but I am really interested in hearing from folks like yourself that have realword commentary of both.


What denon did you get?
 

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Just a note, there is a thread on the Denon 4310 in which a corrupted update has DOA'd many of these units. Completely inexcusable and the non-answers Denon reps were coming up with at the time were also quite lame. This kind of thing tilts the scale in Onkyo's favor.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by runnin' /forum/post/17046589


Just a note, there is a thread on the Denon 4310 in which a corrupted update has DOA'd many of these units. Completely inexcusable and the non-answers Denon reps were coming up with at the time were also quite lame. This kind of thing tilts the scale in Onkyo's favor.

While Onkyo has never painted its glory in firmware updates, it has never bricked a number of players through an offical update. good info to have.


one of the big improvements in the xx7 lineup for onkyo has been the ability to download firmware updates via the lan connection on the 807 and up. before then, firmware was a bit sketchy on onkyos outside of dsp updates via cds.
 

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I bought a 2310


On paper it seems like a huge downgrade from my 875 which I paid $1299 for, but I'm very happy with it sound wise. Except for the downgrade in power, I don't feel I lost anything sound quality wise except for maybe the loss of MultEQ XT to MultEQ which probably gave me slightly better results (but it seems Onkyo is also skimping on XT now as well)


What I like about my Denon, is that it gives me Audyssey Flat target setting which my Onkyo didn't. And as well it did all the menus and status displays overlay over HDMI which I don't believe the Onkyos do except for the Reon models (correct me here if I'm mistaken).


I think you can't really go wrong with either brand in terms of getting good bang for the buck. I wouldn't hestiate to recommend either in terms of sound quality and useful features
 

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Thousands and thousands of happy Denon owners


Thousands and thousands of happy Onkyo owners


Flip a coin and just find the best deal!


if you want to debate power buy and external amp for get more effecient speakers. Power debates wrt to AVRs is like arguing which one legged duck swims faster....NEITHER! BOTH swim in a circle!



btw, I own both Denons and Onkyos!
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by winston9332 /forum/post/17046496


At the $1K level, I can almost get a Denon AVR-3310, which seems under-featured compared to the Onkyo TX NR807. Weight seems to be in Onkyo's court all along. The ABT chip has been better in my experience than the underwhelming Farjouda chip, but we tend not to buy receivers for video processing. Anyone have a chance to compare the two?

Did you see the classified for the Onkyo 876 going for $875?? Seems like a no brainer if someone is looking for a high end AVR under $1K!!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by warpdrive /forum/post/17046653


I bought a 2310


On paper it seems like a huge downgrade from my 875 which I paid $1299 for, but I'm very happy with it sound wise. Except for the downgrade in power, I don't feel I lost anything sound quality wise except for maybe the loss of MultEQ XT to MultEQ which probably gave me slightly better results (but it seems Onkyo is also skimping on XT now as well)


What I like about my Denon, is that it gives me Audyssey Flat target setting which my Onkyo didn't. And as well it did all the menus and status displays overlay over HDMI which I don't believe the Onkyos do except for the Reon models (correct me here if I'm mistaken).


I think you can't really go wrong with either brand in terms of getting good bang for the buck. I wouldn't hestiate to recommend either in terms of sound quality and useful features

stateside you can get a denon 2310 for $550, which seems almost like a no-brainer. that said, a part of me says to hold out to see where prices land on the 807/1007


how does the 2310 compare to the 875 in audio?
 

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ah, cool!


Do all the new products have plIIz? I havent bother to research anything this year. PlIIz doesnt excite me yet.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by winston9332 /forum/post/17046722


stateside you can get a denon 2310 for $550, which seems almost like a no-brainer. that said, a part of me says to hold out to see where prices land on the 807/1007


how does the 2310 compare to the 875 in audio?

As I said, I don't really feel I've downgraded at all in sound quality. Of course, the 875 kills the 2310 in sheer headroom as it should. With my 2310, I feel I'm using at least 50% of its headroom daily, whereas with my Onkyo I feel I'm not tapping even 1/3, it sounds effortless even when I crank up up way past reference.


Denons have always been good to me sound quality wise, and this one doesn't disappoint either. I'd say find the cheapest Denon or Onkyo that meets your needs and flip a coin (or choose based on price alone). What I like about the Denon (like some of the things I've mentioned above that are not always obvious in the specs), I've discovered through using it, not reading spec sheets. If the Onkyo addresses the issues of Audyssey Flat, per-input video settings (yes I think), GUI over HDMI, fast HDMI handshaking, all features I like in the Denon, I would have easily considered the 707 or 807 as well before I bought the Denon.
 

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I returned a 2310 to Abt due to these three issues:


1. The GUI didn't work when the receiver was powered up (the GUI was set to "on" for all of the inputs that I used). I had to select another input, and then go back to the original input, to get it to work.


2. There was a loud "pop" when I changed HD channels with my TiVo S-3s (the SD channels didn't do this).


3. When fast-forwarding thru the commercials of HD shows, recorded on my TiVo S-3s, the screen of my Panny 200 projector would turn blue (loss of signal), until I pressed play (the SD channels didn't do this). I need to see the commercials as they fly by, in order to know when to press play, when the show starts again.


I'm waiting for the Onkyo 3007 now. Hopefully, it won't have these three issues that the 2310 had, in my HT.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elkhunter /forum/post/17047053


I returned a 2310 to Abt due to these three issues:


1. The GUI didn't work when the receiver was powered up (the GUI was set to "on" for all of the inputs that I used). I had to select another input, and then go back to the original input, to get it to work.


2. There was a loud "pop" when I changed HD channels with my TiVo S-3s (the SD channels didn't do this).


3. When fast-forwarding thru the commercials of HD shows, recorded on my TiVo S-3s, the screen of my Panny 200 projector would turn blue (loss of signal), until I pressed play (the SD channels didn't do this). I need to see the commercials as they fly by, in order to know when to press play, when the show starts again.


I'm waiting for the Onkyo 3007 now. Hopefully, it won't have these three issues that the 2310 had, in my HT.

Was there any acknowlesgement by ABT or Denon that this was an isolated hardware issue or some other hard to track down issue that migth plague others?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by warpdrive /forum/post/17046653


I bought a 2310



What I like about my Denon, is that it gives me Audyssey Flat target setting which my Onkyo didn't.

Is this common of most Onkyo's with Audyssey? I've been eyeing the Onkyo 707, but I use the Flat setting almost exclusively on my Denon.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by chas_w /forum/post/17047695


Is this common of most Onkyo's with Audyssey? I've been eyeing the Onkyo 707, but I use the Flat setting almost exclusively on my Denon.

I've never encournted the audyssey flat option in the 906s, 876 or any other onkyo i own or have owned.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Any one do any A/B comparison to the ABT 2010 chip in the denon line up to the Reon in the higher end Onkyos? The Farjouda in the 1007, 807, and 707 was pretty mediocre at best if it's the same carried through from the 806.


I have the ABT 2010 chip in the oppo and the lesser chip in my denon 2010 and have been really impressed by its quality. I just have no idea how good the implementation is in the Denons.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by winston9332 /forum/post/17047629


Was there any acknowlesgement by ABT or Denon that this was an isolated hardware issue or some other hard to track down issue that migth plague others?

I'd say it's an isolated issue. HDMI is very unpredictable at best. I used to have ZERO problems with my Onkyo 875 and then I bought a new TV and then all of the sudden I had all sorts of problems with the signal syncing.


The GUI disappearing from time to time is a more widely reported issue (I've had it happen to me a few times), but it doesn't affect operation and 98% of the time it works fine.


No popping with my Denon either. My Onkyo had a lot more popping going on.


As for Reon vs ABT, I can't tell the difference. Both are superb, and they are as good or better than the scalers in most TVs. However, having spent the money once on the Reon, I don't think I would do it again as the price difference increment wasn't worth it. For me, the ABT's real value is the ability of to do GUI over HDMI.


I think the thing I've learned about ANY receiver is that there are bugs or limitations in the software with ALL of them. If you feel that Onkyo will support patching the firmware in a timely fashion, you might as well stick to Onkyo.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by winston9332 /forum/post/17047719


I've never encournted the audyssey flat option in the 906s, 876 or any other onkyo i own or have owned.

Actually, if you select any of the THX post processing modes avaliable, Onkyo automatically switches from the default Audyssey target curve to FLAT. This has been confirmed by Chris from Audyssey, email him or search the Audyssey thread. The reason is to avoid double high frequency roll-off, (THX Re-EQ on top of the default Audyssey target curve).


Additionally, rickardl did some testing with a 16 kHz tone and found that any "Music" or "Game" THX post processing has Re-EQ=off as default, thus in effect giving you Audyssey FLAT with no high freq roll-off. The drawback is you have to accept THX post processing. THX Cinema modes also have Audyssey FLAT but Re-EQ=on as default. You can set Re-EQ=off, but this setting is not remembered after cycling power.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...4#post15806494
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...9#post15944049
 
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