[stickyfingers]

Let me begin this by saying I really do consider myself provider agnostic. I had D* for many years, moved to a location where I couldn't have satellite - switched to cable - recently moved again and decided to go w/satellite again. I required a provider w/HD, locals, and my regional Fox Sports Net. That left D* or E*. D*'s best HD package for new subs was ~$400, and in 11/03 E* offered the 811 for $0. Choice was pretty easy for me - even though I'd never been an E* sub. I had a disastrous time actually getting my 811 which is detailed over here - so I'll spare the details (except that it took nearly 2 months to actually be installed).


At every moment during that two months I was so angry w/every part of E*'s customer service I kept waiting for D* to offer some competitive offer so I could cancel my E* install and switch over to D* - it never happened. So on 1/23 my 811 was finally installed and running and I've had the weekend to play w/it, and here's my thoughts:


1) There's a fairly large set of bugs that still plague the 811 and they're well detailed in other threads. I had hoped that some of these would turn out to be isolated incidents - they were not. Many of these bugs require a hard reboot, and my unit doesn't usually respond to the holding of the power button. My surge protector is WAY back and requires about 20 minutes of moving stuff to get to it and then moving stuff back so the reboot problems are a major PITA.


2) The E* guide is absolutely horrendous. I'm not trying to be overly critical, but the guide on my 811 actually looks *worse* than the guide on both my first BUD unit and my first D* unit (we had our first BUD *well* over 10 years ago, and our first D* unit nearly 8 years ago I think). It looks like it was a GUI project done by a Junior High programming class. This is a well-documented bug as well, but on the 811 you can't view your guide w/out losing the programming you're currently watching. The "guide window" will occasionally manage to hold the picture of your original channel, but never for any period of time. Lastly, on the guide, there's no means to stretch the guide to 16:9 even though it's an HD receiver. Huh?! As I have a CRT I'm *very* careful to not run 4:3 material on my set, and I shudder when I think of the amount of time I probably spend in the guide. (did I mention the guide often only holds *hours* of information?)


3) I would be remiss if I didn't mention that the actual HD image produced by the 811 is stunning. I have been very, very pleased when I actually am watching an HD program. (sorry, that's about the only compliment I have to pay the 811)


All in all, I picked up the 811 for free w/a 1 year programming committment. The new sub plan I'm on gave me three free months of programming, and I picked up three more months free due to the horrible experience I had actually getting one to my house. So I figure that I've got 6 months free, and I'll be able to EBay the 811 for enough to mostly cover the last 6 months of programming I'm contracted for - ultimately I'll be watching E* for free for one year.


I won't gripe too heavily (yet - if things get worse I reserve my right to gripe ) knowing that it was all free - but I post this as a caution to folks who might be considering paying for an 811. There is no doubt in my mind that the 811 certainly is not nearly stable enough to warrant actually being available for purchase - had I *paid* for one of these I would be *furious*. I feel like a beta tester (which I've done for several companies) - I'm getting to use a product for free, and in return I'm aware there exist many issues which need work.


I will certainly be hopping ship back to D* for an HD Tivo, either immediately if new subs have a great incentive package, or as soon as my 1 year is up otherwise. The whole experience w/E* from start to install to user experience has just felt really really second rate and half-baked - but for free, I'd probably do it again.


Brian

 

[AcuraCL]

Well, I suspect Dish won't miss a customer like yourself. You sound more like a parasite than a customer. As a Dish stockholder, I won't miss ya a bit. Good luck with DirectTV !!

 

[Darin]

Wow, it's too bad you couldn't get in on the no committment offer they now have. Hate to be stuck with that for a year.

 

[rmcgirr83]

Quote:

Originally posted by AcuraCL Well, I suspect Dish won't miss a customer like yourself. You sound more like a parasite than a customer. As a Dish stockholder, I won't miss ya a bit. Good luck with DirectTV !!

That was totally uncalled for. The poster was just giving his experiences. You don't like it, don't respond and keep your pithy little comments that do nothing to yourself.

 

[stickyfingers]

Quote:

Originally posted by Darin Wow, it's too bad you couldn't get in on the no committment offer they now have. Hate to be stuck with that for a year.

IIRC, the no committment offer is that DHP thingy, where basically you lease the equipment. I'd prefer to own it and Ebay it. Since I'm going to be selling it for a net wash, I don't "feel" like I'm committed at all. The first six months are free, and the next six will be covered (or close to it) by the sale of the 811. If D* offered up an HDTivo to new subs for $499 tommorrow, I'd sign up in a heartbeat.


Brian

 

[Darin]

Yeah, I did mean the lease program. Didn't realize that what you had gave you service for six months for free, so that is a good deal. Hell, in six months, things at Dish could be completely different anyway.

 

[RodneyK]

Quote:

Originally posted by AcuraCL Well, I suspect Dish won't miss a customer like yourself. You sound more like a parasite than a customer. As a Dish stockholder, I won't miss ya a bit. Good luck with DirectTV !!

I sure hope you're not in any kind of service industry. Without customers what do you think your shares are going to be worth?

 

[AcuraCL]

Quote:

Originally posted by RodneyK I sure hope you're not in any kind of service industry. Without customers what do you think your shares are going to be worth?

There are customers who are profit suckers and customers who are profit makers. I'd try to alienate the profit suckers, personally. They only hurt the bottom line.


My reaction to his post was visceral. Sorry. I get tired of reading posts from people who think that anything goes in terms of getting what they can out of a company, ANY company. It seems they think they're incredibly clever. Everyone ought to get pissed off at such people, because ultimately we ALL pay for their "free months" of programming/ equipment/whatever.


Think about it.

 

[Darin]

Quote:

Originally posted by AcuraCL I get tired of reading posts from people who think that anything goes in terms of getting what they can out of a company...

Huh? It didnt' sound to me like he was trying to take advantage of Dish. he simply signed up for a promotion, under Dish's terms, and reported his experience. Is expecting a bug-free product too much?

 

[RodneyK]

Did you even read his post? He has legitimate gripes about a piece of equipment that some people have paid (and some will pay) good money for. If I was about to plunk down $400 for a new receiver, that is the kind of stuff I would like to know.


I've owned a 6000 since they first came out and it still has almost all of the problems that it did from day one. I have serious doubts that any but the worst of the problems that people are having with the 811 will be fixed, either.


BTW, how do you know how to differentiate "customers who are profit suckers and customers who are profit makers"? Seems to me that they first have to be a customer and if you alienate any of them, THAT hurts your bottom line. What do I know?

 

[AcuraCL]

Quote:

Originally posted by Darin Huh? It didnt' sound to me like he was trying to take advantage of Dish. he simply signed up for a promotion, under Dish's terms, and reported his experience. Is expecting a bug-free product too much?

Darin, it was this paragraph that set me off:


"All in all, I picked up the 811 for free w/a 1 year programming committment. The new sub plan I'm on gave me three free months of programming, and I picked up three more months free due to the horrible experience I had actually getting one to my house. So I figure that I've got 6 months free, and I'll be able to EBay the 811 for enough to mostly cover the last 6 months of programming I'm contracted for - ultimately I'll be watching E* for free for one year."


"Horrible experience" ??? What is that, they came and tortured you with hot pokers? Or, you mean, by horrible experience, that you just had to ... um, wait for it?


So, free equipment, free programming for 6 months, and selling the free receiver to pay for the programming commitment ....


I don't want to get into a flame war here. I reacted strongly to an attitude I perceived. If you're okay with it, that's cool.


I just feel like it's important, once in a while, to let people know that not everyone agrees with their behavior.


And I DO believe I, and you, and everyone else, DOES pick up the cost for his freebies.


That's all. Sorry I offended by expressing my opinion.

 

[stickyfingers]

Quote:

Originally posted by AcuraCL ...I get tired of reading posts from people who think that anything goes in terms of getting what they can out of a company, ANY company. It seems they think they're incredibly clever. Everyone ought to get pissed off at such people, because ultimately we ALL pay for their "free months" of programming/ equipment/whatever...

I had dismissed you as a troll, but since others have responded to your post - I'll chime in. I'm going to guess you decided to troll w/out bothering to read the thread I linked to where my disastrous experience w/E* was echoed by others. Give that one a read sometime.


Anyhow, I signed up w/E* when they offered a free 811 and 301 for new subscribers including three months free service. That was the terms of the offer. As is detailed in the linked thread, E* confirmed and missed four install appointments - the fifth was actually kept. I'm not the highest paid employee on earth, but I make ~$200/day, the four previous misses cost me ~$800. E* offered (w/out me asking) 1 month of free programming for every miss after the first one - hence the additional three free months programming. It seems to me they got the better of that deal, I "lost" about $800, they "lost" about $175 in programming credits.


I started this particular thread not to have E* flogged (again) for their terrible customer service, inventory management, or the like - rather simply to provide my opinion as a first time E* sub on the merits of the 811 in particular and E* in general. If you, as a "stock holder," have a reason to be "pissed" then perhaps you should vent at E* for all of the issues listed here (and in the other 811/921 threads) that, in my case, will lead to me heading back to D* as soon as the HD Tivo arrives. I, too, would be concerned if I was an E* shareholder for the massive amount of ill will they've generated due to the mishandling of the 811 and 921 rollouts. Heck, it sounds like you're upset w/E* for offering their "three free months" promotion...


FWIW, I would imagine I'm *exactly* the customer a television provider looks for as I don't have any love relationship w/a particular provider. I simply evaulate my choices based on merit/value and choose the provider that best fits me. I tried E*, I'm sorry you had issues with my experience.


I still think you're simply a troll, and I won't respond to your vitriol again.


Brian

 

[rmcgirr83]

Quote:

Originally posted by stickyfingers I had dismissed you as a troll, but since others have responded to your post - I'll chime in. I'm going to guess you decided to troll w/out bothering to read the thread I linked to where my disastrous experience w/E* was echoed by others. Give that one a read sometime. Anyhow, I signed up w/E* when they offered a free 811 and 301 for new subscribers including three months free service. That was the terms of the offer. As is detailed in the linked thread, E* confirmed and missed four install appointments - the fifth was actually kept. I'm not the highest paid employee on earth, but I make ~$200/day, the four previous misses cost me ~$800. E* offered (w/out me asking) 1 month of free programming for every miss after the first one - hence the additional three free months programming. It seems to me they got the better of that deal, I "lost" about $800, they "lost" about $175 in programming credits. I started this particular thread not to have E* flogged (again) for their terrible customer service, inventory management, or the like - rather simply to provide my opinion as a first time E* sub on the merits of the 811 in particular and E* in general. If you, as a "stock holder," have a reason to be "pissed" then perhaps you should vent at E* for all of the issues listed here (and in the other 811/921 threads) that, in my case, will lead to me heading back to D* as soon as the HD Tivo arrives. I, too, would be concerned if I was an E* shareholder for the massive amount of ill will they've generated due to the mishandling of the 811 and 921 rollouts. Heck, it sounds like you're upset w/E* for offering their "three free months" promotion... FWIW, I would imagine I'm *exactly* the customer a television provider looks for as I don't have any love relationship w/a particular provider. I simply evaulate my choices based on merit/value and choose the provider that best fits me. I tried E*, I'm sorry you had issues with my experience. I still think you're simply a troll, and I won't respond to your vitriol again. Brian

Nice job, Brian. I only wish I had the forsight to ignore his rude and caustic comments.


It's not your fault that E*, big surprise here, dropped the ball. I would have offered the same thing to try a keep a, hopefully, paying customer. Gee, I wonder why Sonyara (sp?) left E* anyway.

 

[Darin]

Quote:

Originally posted by AcuraCL So, free equipment, free programming for 6 months, and selling the free receiver to pay for the programming commitment ....

I still don't get your beef. The free equipment is Dish's deal to get customers. That is what they need to do to be competitive with cable. Obviously, it is worth it to them, because they feel that they will make more money off of the customer than they spend on him. If they are providing a product that does not live up to acceptable standards, THEY are the ones who have failed if the customers don't stay longer than the period THEY determined was reasonable for an agreement to give them a box.


I think your feelings need to be re-directed to those who are doing their stock-holders a disservice. If I had Dish stock, I'd be pissed too, but not at the customers who were leaving.

 

[AcuraCL]

Quote:

Originally posted by stickyfingers I had dismissed you as a troll, but since others have responded to your post - I'll chime in. I'm going to guess you decided to troll w/out bothering to read the thread I linked to where my disastrous experience w/E* was echoed by others. Give that one a read sometime. Anyhow, I signed up w/E* when they offered a free 811 and 301 for new subscribers including three months free service. That was the terms of the offer. As is detailed in the linked thread, E* confirmed and missed four install appointments - the fifth was actually kept. I'm not the highest paid employee on earth, but I make ~$200/day, the four previous misses cost me ~$800. E* offered (w/out me asking) 1 month of free programming for every miss after the first one - hence the additional three free months programming. It seems to me they got the better of that deal, I "lost" about $800, they "lost" about $175 in programming credits. I started this particular thread not to have E* flogged (again) for their terrible customer service, inventory management, or the like - rather simply to provide my opinion as a first time E* sub on the merits of the 811 in particular and E* in general. If you, as a "stock holder," have a reason to be "pissed" then perhaps you should vent at E* for all of the issues listed here (and in the other 811/921 threads) that, in my case, will lead to me heading back to D* as soon as the HD Tivo arrives. I, too, would be concerned if I was an E* shareholder for the massive amount of ill will they've generated due to the mishandling of the 811 and 921 rollouts. Heck, it sounds like you're upset w/E* for offering their "three free months" promotion... FWIW, I would imagine I'm *exactly* the customer a television provider looks for as I don't have any love relationship w/a particular provider. I simply evaulate my choices based on merit/value and choose the provider that best fits me. I tried E*, I'm sorry you had issues with my experience. I still think you're simply a troll, and I won't respond to your vitriol again. Brian

I am not a troll, truly, and I apologize for having misinterpreted your original post. You were most gracious to explain further.


***********

This coupon entitles you to one free flame of AcuraCL at no cost.

***********


I have expressed my concerns to Dish, having gone through similar experiences with their customer service myself lately.


Sorry again.

 

[redline65]

I guess my experience was better. I called and ordered on 1/10, and had the system installed on 1/13. I got the Free 811/301/301 deal. The installer ran into a minor snag running some cable, but other than that it went smooth. Picture quality with SD material is much better than my cable was, and HD looks fantastic. There were no surprises on my first bill, everthing was explained very clearly at the time I signed up (I tend to stress about terms that change or fees you find out about after the fact). My 811 receiver does have some of the problems mentioned, but I haven't run across any that have been a major PITA (but I'm not a perfectionist either). In two weeks I've never had to unplug my 811, but I've reset it about 3 times by holding the power button on the receiver. Overall I'm very satisified with Dish.

 

[frostlich]

Guess I kinda got mixed feelings right now about E*. No, guess I don't have any feelings whatsoever about E*.


As a current customer, I placed an email to the executive offices and received an immediate call back offering me the 811 upgrade for $149. Very satisfied with that part of the service.


Unfortunately, when the ball was turned over to local dish provider it was dropped. 811 was supposed to be installed this morning, Dish called yesterday to reschedule because their installer called in with the flu. At least they called ahead of time instead of just being a no-show. Since their earliest possible reschedule date was 2/6, after the superbowl, I told them just to cancel the install altogether. Now, I don't expect them to beg me to reconsider, but the 'I could give a rats ass' attitude finally just made the whole thing not worth while. I believed I was quite decent and reasonable throughout the whole process.


Perhaps I'm not being fair, should call back the executive offices, etc., but I just don't think this hassle is worth it anymore.


On the plus side, this whole debacle gave me time to reconsider getting my HDTV service through dish. Do I really want to pay $150 up front, +$15 extra per month for a reportedly buggy receiver? I'll spend roughly the same amount one time for a SIR T151 OTA receiver, and not worry about it anymore. Only thing I might miss is ESPN HD, but I can live without it.

 

[bsic]

I cant complain either-


Order E* service for the first time 301/501 about 2 yrs ago. Never had one complaint as an AEP subscriber. Not one.


Called to upgrade to an 811, had it installed on the first scheduled date (within 2 weeks of first call), and am very happy with the unit. A few bugs which are minor irritants- the picture-in-guide is buggy/unstable, and OTA mapping is buggy, but dish recognizes it and a patch in the next few weeks (P264/265) will fix these and other minor irritants. Not really a big deal to me- certainly not worth cancelling for, IMO.

 

[stickyfingers]

Quote:

Originally posted by bsic I cant complain either...A few bugs which are minor irritants- the picture-in-guide is buggy/unstable, and OTA mapping is buggy, but dish recognizes it and a patch in the next few weeks (P264/265) will fix these and other minor irritants. Not really a big deal to me- certainly not worth cancelling for, IMO.

Have you had D*? DTivo? Used any of the D* HD units? If so, do you really find the E* units comparable?


Brian