480p and 720p upscaling is a Myth. They are trying to create resolution that isn't there. Garbage in = Garbage out. Also what source do you have that is still 480p?

Yes you are definitely overthinking this just like many other people do. All of the 4K TVs look great with high quality sources. Where they differ the most is in how they handle compression noise in the lower quality over compressed signals.

I think that the biggest issue people have when buying a new TV is that they buy a much bigger TV and still sit very close to it. The input resolution doesn't change and sitting close to a much bigger TV will show all of the issues with the input signal much more.

Your best bet is to go with a moderately larger 4K TV that has good digital noise reduction algorithms for the more compressed cable/SAT signals. Then for the higher quality Blu-ray and streaming signals just turn all of the processing off.

 

My satellite system (dish and receiver) is presently Directv SD and of course OTA in my area (I think?) is also broadcasting some channels below 1080. Upgrading to HD Satellite is not a viable option since I am about to permanently loose line of sight with no other alternative installation location. Therefore, eventually I am just going to "cut the cable" so to speak and rely on OTA, Roku, Netflix, etc. Even then some programming is going to be coming in at 480 and 720, right?

I will not be going with a larger TV, about same size. In LED terms that is about a 40"-42" range at about 7 feet viewing distance.

Again, I realize an "upscaled" picture will not be the clarity of native 1080, but I also don't want to buy a TV that has a clearly inferior PQ in rendering the lower resolutions, so how am I to know which makes/models to target or avoid?

Or.....iron me out if I am entirely off base in my concern....

Sonic

 

Again, I realize an "upscaled" picture will not be the clarity of native 1080, but I also don't want to buy a TV that has a clearly inferior PQ in rendering the lower resolutions, so how am I to know which makes/models to target or avoid?

Sonic

Don't avoid any of them for 480p or 720p upscaling. They all look the same. Can you tell which one of the following images is from the "Bad Upscaling" TV and which ones are from the "Good Upscaling" TVs? They all look like Cr@p to me when compared to the 4K image or even 1080p image.

 

Upscaling will differ between TVs. It is something of a personal preference though.

My advice would be to download some 480i/p content on a USB stick, take it to a store, and try it on a variety of manufactures sets and see which one you prefer.

As you know, it isn't going to look awesome but upscaling isn't a myth.

Quality 720p should upscale fairly well. The problem with 720p content is some of the 720p content from cable and satellite providers is overcompressed and has artifacts in the content itself. No scalar can fix artifacts in the source.

 

You will be fine. OTA and streaming services are generally HD.

 

How my concern came about is that one TV review site now does upscale testing and indicated that Vizio has slightly inferior upscaling, and one Samsung set I was looking oddly fell short in 720 upscaling (which was unexpected).

I actually thought about trying the "480 on USB drive approach" to demo in the stores... but none of the stores ever have remotes accessible, so I'm not sure it would do any good simply plugging in a USB drive.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought various streaming services, as well as standard DVD content, can often be 720 and not necessarily always 1080. And OTA ranges anywhere from 480 to 1080. If this is generally correct, then upscaling quality may matter, hence my inquiry.

I was leaning toward an E-series Vizio as a starter TV for a few years, but it seems Vizio's upscaling is known to be a bit substandard? Again, not sure if I'm over thinking things or if most all upscaling these days is going to look similar. Never having owned a HiDef LED/LCD TV before makes things rather difficult, which is why I'm hoping for some guidance on this upscaling matter so I can lessen the chances of making a purchase mistake in that regard.

Sonic

 

I actually thought about trying the "480 on USB drive approach" to demo in the stores... but none of the stores ever have remotes accessible, so I'm not sure it would do any good simply plugging in a USB drive.

If you ask they can usually accommodate you, depending on the store.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought various streaming services, as well as standard DVD content, can often be 720 and not necessarily always 1080. And OTA ranges anywhere from 480 to 1080. If this is generally correct, then upscaling quality may matter, hence my inquiry.

OTA signals vary materially by region. You should be able to find out what quality of OTA signals are available where you are.

Most streaming services high HD streaming available but streaming quality will vary depending on bandwidth. Will you have high-speed internet where you are going? How fast will it be?

 

Any streaming service I have used is 720P or 1080i/p I guess there could be old 480 content available (VUDU?), but I havent watched any of it. OTA is available in HD and will be 720P or 1080i. DVD is 480P. On a 40 - 42" TV I wouldnt worry about it. If you really want to compare, see if the store will let you want a DVD on different sets.

 

Interesting....The E series Vizio looks noticeably worse than the others but then again it may be the actual screen/pixels more than the upscaling per-se? Oddly, my eyes seem to think the 4th image is the best of the 480 bunch - which is actually an M series Vizio.

This isn't helping the cause for an E series choice.

 

Viewing angles will always be bad on LCD's. They get better with IPS panels or higher end models.

Have you audition this one?

http://www.rtings.com/reviews/tv/lcd-led/sony/w600b

 

Yes actually, twice. I didn't notice anything significantly different from the 510C, but keep in mind I'm dealing with a store setting so who knows how messed with the settings were. But in sports scenes there seemed to be more blur going on than on the 510C and even more than the 2015 Vizio E. Maybe I was imagining things. The other concern I had with the W600B is there is widely reported USB file-scan delay and annoyingly slow remote control response on the Smart aspects.

 

Hello,

I'm new to LED/LCD TV's and have now learned most of the basics in my endeavor to eventually purchase a 1080 TV. However, I am still struggling with the notion of upscaling as it pertains to PQ. Initially I will be using an SD satellite receiver mixed with some OTA, ROKU free programming and eventually Netflix (to replace the satellite receiver) Can some experts on the forum please comment on upscaling aspects regarding the different major brands such as Vizio, Sony, Samsung? When I go to any store they are all running 1080 demo loops so I have no way to see what 480 or 720 will render like. And since I have never owned a HiDef TV before I frankly do not understand what kind of content spectrum to actually expect from my viewing sources at home. So it is making it rather difficult to choose a TV if indeed I need to really be concerned about upscaling algorithms inside the TV. The best I can do at the moment is rely on sites like rtings.com.

Am I over-thinking this, or are some TV's just plain bad at sub-1080 upscaling and should therefore be scratched from consideration? If the latter, how do I know what makes/models to target???

Help....

Sonic

Hey, you could do what I did: just keep your old CRT
TV, and watch 480 content on that.

I have a 25-year-old Mitsubishi CRT that sits right
below my big-screen flat-screen, and I watch 480 content
(all the oldies stations on OTA) on that preferentially,
and I even watch "Jeopardy!" every night on it.

Basically, though, you don't have that much to worry
about "upscaling", unless you have a dodgy decoder
and upscaling just makes it more apparent if you're
sitting too close to the big screen. But doing a side by
side comparison (actually top by bottom) of the two
TV technologies is illuminating. The CRT has a
brighter, more "contrasty" picture, and the LCD, ANY
LCD, will look fuzzier and more washed out, and this
is particularly apparent with 480 content.

But it's different trade-off when you're talking about
true HD, then I almost always watch that on the LCD.
Some of this is "perceptual" not real, but some of it
is definitely the known differences between the two
technologies, especially when viewing digital video...

--
maxreactance